Those Xero sandals look really promising.  I would love to ditch the Chacos and these look like they can cut the weight by almost a pound while still being useful sandals.  That's a big deal.  Thanks for posting.

If I am touring I use Chaco sandals.  I can hike and ride flats in them but mainly they are just good shoes for the water, fishing, swimming and hiking around camp.  They are heavy but they just released a "lighter"  version at 20 ounces for a pair.  That still makes them the single heaviest item in my sub 20 pound touring kit.  For me they are worth the weight.

We did most of these trails this summer as, based on research and reports, we deviated from the main singletrack route.  We thought the climb up Big Boulder was the best of the entire route.  What a fantastic mostly singletrack climb.  While there is no way to spin a 4000 foot mostly single track climb as easy we liked it so much we did Little - Big Boulder as a 'rest day' loop.  I too am puzzled at the route selection from Bowery.  I agree with Evdog, Big Boulder is the prefered method for gaining the 4000-5000 feet required to make the high country.  Thanks for the post.  Posting our trip write up is still on my to do list.

That Decker creek was a wake up call for sure.  The unknown and sometimes primitive nature of the trails makes it hard to plan for food correctly.  One day we will do 50 miles and the next 19 miles and the 19 will take longer than the 50.  I am going to post up our account soon.  I think if enough people post accounts of their journeys it will be helpful for future travelers to estimate mileage and time; although, not knowing was one of the reasons we wanted to do it in the first year.  The unknown is part of the allure for some people.  We ran into the Canadians that were on the pass a few times and spent 2 nights with them.  We also ran into a few groups on the main route but we didn't see anyone else on the singletrack sections.

Gabriel,

I was wondering how the cut off worked out.  We caught up with you on the pass at Decker Creek as your group was deciding what route to take after that 'leisurely' 6 hour HAB fest up to the top.  How do you think the Alturas Lake cut off worked out?  From your Limberlost posts you look and sound pretty tired but that could have been due to the weather.  It took us and the Canadians over three hours just to go DOWNHILL from the pass to the hot springs.  I hope you had smoother riding. Anyway, thanks for posting.

We just rode from Alder Creek to Idaho City today Thursday July 17 and the road is still open. Lots of fire personnel around and it is very smokey. We hope it is better once we cross over to the Bosie River.

Thanks Casey!  We are looking forward to this route.  Starting out on July 11th.  Should be awesome.  Thanks for all of your work on this.

Casey,

Thanks for the update.  How is the work coming on the GPS file?  Will it have water sources / hot springs as waypoints?

Casey,

Thanks for the information on the closure.  When do you think the gpx file for the route will be completed and available for download?

I posted some distances and times earlier in this thread but just think about surface and total elevation.  As mentioned in the previous post, we are planning on averaging 35 miles per day and 3000 feet of climbing as based on the elevation profiles which we know from experience dramatically under estimate total elevation gain.  That means about 25 miles on the singletrack sections and 45 on the dirt road sections.  That distance sounds wimpy; however, figure your average speed on dirt with all that climbing.  For two experienced but 40ish bikepackers that is 8-12 mph.  Half that for the singletrack sections where 4-8 mph is realistic.  Then just math out how long you want to be rolling for.  For us, that is 4-6 hours of 'rolling wheel time' which means 7-10 hours traversing the landscape from break down to set up.  Navigation, lunch, pumping water, going  for a swim, ect... all consume time.   That schedule works for us as cycle tourists.  If your idea of a good time is waking up early and hammering all day then you can disregard this post; however, if you want to swim, fish, soak in the hot springs and sit around a camp fire then think about how much time it really takes and set your schedule accordingly.

Casey,

I am sure the maps will be fine for navigation but will there be a GPS file released for the route before summer?  I did the Great Divide Route with just the maps and never once got lost but single track can be a bit more confusing.  If you have a GPS file I would download it as backup.  I have found a few minor discrepancies on the maps.  I have been meaning to PM you about them but I have been busy and then I heard about the avalanche and figured you had more important concerns than work.  I will try to get to it in a week or so.  I am glad to read that you and yours are all safe and well. 

BigCog,

How far you can, or want, to go depends on primarily on fitness, road surface, and elevation.  What I do when estimating a new route is I figure out how far I can comfortably ride with a load on an average dirt road and how much climbing I can do before it stops being fun.  For me on dirt roads at the start of a tour I aim for 40 miles and 3000 feet of climbing.  If it will be only 2000 feet of climbing then I add 5 miles of distance.  conversely, if the day has 4000 feet of climbing I subtract 5 miles of distance.  Keep in mind that my experience with ACA elevation profiles is that they underestimate the total climbing by about 25%.

Another method you could use is the 'Average Speed' method.  Figure out your average speed on a dirt road with a similar amount of time and climbing.  For example, if you can average 10 MPH with a loaded bike on dirt then figure out how much time you want to spend rolling.  Keep in mind that navigation, lunch, breaks, ect don't count.  So for me, a tourist in no hurry, at an average speed of 10MPH 40 miles is 4 hours rolling or 7-8 hours of traversing the landscape.  Your fitness, age, and desire to tour or hammer will influence your decision on milage.  I hope this helps.

My friend and I have a saying for our 'plans' that we make when touring.  There are plans A, B, and C but what we actually end up doing is plan 'J'.  That is what makes it an adventure.

Gabriel,

I have been pouring over the maps as well.  My buddy and I are planning on leaving from McCall in mid July and doing the single track sections plus the Little Boulder Loop which looks like it will add a day and change to the route.  We are in our mid 40s and in no hurry so we are trying to average 35 miles per day and around 3000 feet of climbing.  More on forest service road and less on single track.  That makes it 21 days of riding.  We have done a number of these types of tours over the past few years and we are always shocked how much slower the single track sections are.  All it takes is one year of missed chainsaw crew to blow out an ideal schedule.  I have an itinerary all worked up if you want to PM me I can send it to you and you can chime in on what is wrong with it. Plenty I am sure. Especially since those elevation profiles are notorious for under estimating the total elevation gain. As to your questions.....

By all accounts Little Boulder is a superb trail.  We are adding it in even though it really stretches our ability to carry enough food through that section.

I have been doing research on the Alturas Lake connector and what little I have found is not very promising.  It would also make the food logistics very challenging. Hopefully some others in this forum will have better news.

Let us know what you find out about the other trails as I do not know anything about them.  I am sure a lot of good information will come out next year after a bunch of people have ridden it.

Sweet!  Thanks for letting us know.

Thanks for the info Casey.  I am looking forward to getting my hands on these maps and then my tires on that dirt.

Casey,

Thanks for sharing all of this information.  To catch up from previous posts, I was thinking about the Chamberlin Basin camp option, as long as I can carry enough food for a layover day on that section.  As for the question about the route from Alturas Lake to Atlanta, trail I was referring to skirts the wilderness boundary.  Heading South East from Alturas Lake along Alturas Creek there is a seasonal motorcycle trail #7034 that connects with trail #7226 and #7227 along the Ross Forks. It looks to be about 15-20 miles.  From there it appears that in connects near Ross Peak with Decker Creek #7228 and Willow Creek #7018 which, from what I have been able to deduce from the map you released, are part of the route from Atlanta.  The link to the trail map I am referring to can be found here http://www.trails.Idaho.gov/trails/ .  I have done enough route construction on other rides to know that a trail on the map is not necessarily there (or ridable).  I can't seem to find any beta on line so I thought I would ask you. Any information you have on this potential connector would be appreciated. Thanks!

Thanks for the update.  Can we pre order with ACA?

Thanks for the info.  I am really looking forward to the White Clouds section. It has been a solid 10 years since I have ridden that area.  Is there any compelling reason that you left out the famous, well known, secret zip your lips trail from that section?  I am planning on tacking it on to the route unless you have some reason that it should be left out. I am assuming that the partial loop nature of it just did not fit well with the route design.  Any information you care to share about routing in that area would be appreciated.  Thanks.

Casey,

I have been geeking out on maps and have pretty much figured out the route from the small map you posted.  After looking at the route I was wondering if there is a preferred direction of travel, especially for the single track sections?  Also, did you explore/ride the Idaho Centennial trail that connects Alturas Lake with Atlanta?  If so, is that section ridable.  I have not been able to find much beta on it.  I am really looking forward to getting my hands on the maps soon. Thanks.