[Ogre]

I've decided that I like plus size tires enough to consider eliminating my Ogre (with Enabler fork) and my Ventana El Rey (full suspension 29er), and going with something that handles bigger rubber better, but I'm having some decision paralysis.

Here are my current mtn bikes.  The goal is to reduce down to bike that can be a bit of a chameleon and handle most everything:

Ogre
- 29x3" Fat-B-Nimble tires (but they barely fit and the the hub needs to be pulled pretty far back in the dropouts)
- Salsa Enabler fork with front wheel built up with a 135mm single-speed hub
- 1x8 with an Alfine 8 hub.
- Rims are Velocity Blunts (35mm)

Ventana
- 2.2" tires (2.4-2.5" would be the max)
- X-Fusion Slide 29er susp. fork
- 3x9 Shimano XT drivetrain

The 29x3" rubber on the Ogre fits, but just barely.  If the rim goes the least little bit out of true, or the hub is anything but perfectly aligned in the dropouts, I get rubbing so I would like some more space.  My initial thought was go to a dedicated 29+ bike like a Krampus or an ECR.  But I have this tingle in the back of my head that I would like to try a fat bike at some point.  A Krampus or ECR can never be a fat bike, but a Pugsley can be just about anything and it seems plenty of people run their Pugs with 29+ tires.

I did a quick, back-of-napkin comparison between the 3 frames for cost:

- it seems that going with a Krampus or a Puglsey will cost nearly same by the time you account for parts that would need to be purchased due to lack of compatibility from my Ogre, if I have to buy new rims for the Pugsley (unclear on this).  If I can get away with my existing rims for an offset build on the Pugs, the Krampus becomes a bit more expensive due to the seatpost, headset, and ICT fork.
- Going with an ECR would be the cheapest - my Enabler fork is a direct swap, as are my wheelsets.  

Effort is a different story - for the ECR and Krampus, I mostly just swap the parts and go riding; for the Pugsley, I'll be tearing down and rebuiliding wheels

The few things that I keep coming back to:

- A Krampus is more trail oriented than touring, and most of my riding is "touring" in nature (gravel grinding, some trail).  This being said, I've never heard anyone complain on how a Pugsley behaves on singletrack, or how a Krampus rides on gravel.  I've read about the low BB and pedal strike for the ECR on trails, and the bike feeling "heavy/dead" when unloaded (only what I've read).
- A Krampus or ECR can never be fat bikes, but a Pugsley can be almost anything
- Krampus can run front suspension; I believe the susp. fork on my Ventana will fit the ECR; currently uncertain about the Pugsley.
- For the Krampus and ECR, with a switch of the fork, I basically have 2 wheelsets ready-to-go with the option of IGH, Singlespeed, or geared  
- Wheels built for a Pugsley will only be for a Pugsley, unless I tear them down again.  I'm typically not swapping wheels around and if I only have the 1 mtn bike there is no other bike to worry about, so maybe this concern isn't real

I'd be curious to hear if others have considered the same options and where you ended up!

Thanks!

What width bars did you guys go with?

The bars on my mountain bikes are wide (~60cm).  I tend to be out on my bar ends a lot since I have long arms.  The randonneur bar on my commuter is ~42cm and at times I feel cramped and would like to "open up" a bit.  I was considering the 48cm offerings despite the guidance that drop bar sizing for me would be 42-44cm.

Thanks!  

Does anyone have firsthand experience with either of these bars?

I'm looking to change up my Ogre a bit and move from flat bars with clamp-on aero bars to a drop bar.  I know, the Ogre is not "designed" to run a drop bar but lots of guys do it on Ogre and Karate Monkeys.  I run an Alfine 8 hub, so the plan is put an accessory mount on the drop bars and simply transfer the trigger shifter to the new bars.  It is not an elegant solution, but until I can get a set of Gevenalle brifters, it is a cheap solution.  If I set this up right, I should be able to swap handlebar setups with minimal fuss.

I've looked at dedicated dirt drops and don't feel they will work.  I like to ride the hoods a lot so the Dajia Far Bar and Salsa Cowchipper looked like good options.  Neither is inexpensive so I'm hoping to get some first hand reports before I commit.

Far Bar -
http://store.velo-orange.com/index.php/dajia-far-bar-handlebar-black.html

Cowchipper -
http://ridinggravel.com/gravel-news/fresh-gravel-salsa-cycles-cowchipper-bar/
https://www.velocipedesalon.com/forum/f40/salsas-new-cowchipper-bars-41237.html

Thanks!

My wife is a pro photographer and she lets me play with her equipment a little (Nikon D700 and D750).  I cannot imagine taking that gear on any kind of a trip where carrying the weight, keeping things dry, and keeping things safe would be major considerations.  Even the smaller, hobbiest DLSRs are heavy and take up major room.

We had looked at the new Sony mirrorless DSLRs (Alpha series) for nice equipment to take on trips.  A colleague of hers traded in all his Nikon gear and went 100% Sony and doesn't regret it; the bodies are half the size and weight of most Canon and Nikon DSLRs.  The major hurdle for her/us is that she is fully invested in Nikon bodies and lenses, and doesn't do many events where she is carrying multiple cameras on her person, so it doesn't make sense to get anything that isn't compatible with Nikon.

So my advise - buy the best small digital camera you can with the best built-in OPTICAL ZOOM lens or look at the Sony Alpha (and competing cameras) that are small but have interchangeable lenses. 

Before I read any of the posts under post #1, I thought - Surly Troll.

My only other thought is a Co-Motion, but it would blow your budget immediately. 

Someone mentioned being able to run a rear hub in the front fork.  This isn't a bad idea and how I have my Surly Ogre set up (Alfine8 rear and singlespeed front with an Enabler fork).  If I do a tour, I plan to stay in North America but the option of drivetrain is a comforting thought.  I mostly did it because I'm A.D.D. and it was cheaper and easier to set it up to run multiple drivetrains.

So my vote is Surly Troll with a front fork spaced to 135mm and run a singlespeed hub.

Apologies for dredging up an old thread but this topic is exactly what I posted on in a different forum.

Is the Schwalbe Big One a replacement for the Super Moto in their product line?  I cannot find the Super Moto in stock anywhere.

I have a Surly Ogre that I'm outfitting to be my "everything" bike with a change in tires for the trip.  Someday I may look to a cyclocross or gravel bike but for now the Orge has to fill the gap.  I'm mostly riding mixed gravel and rough pavement in a rural area.  I'm considering other tires like the Vee Speedster and the Hookworm along with the Big One/Super Moto.

Despite being light and fast, I've read some negative feedback about durability.  I suppose that is to be expected; they are beach tires after all.

Thanks! 

A couple years ago I was gifted a Magellan eXplorist 710 handheld GPS:

http://www.magellangps.com/Store/eXploristSeries/eXplorist-710

I haven't used it a ton but works well enough for my purposes.  Can run for 16hrs. on 2 AA batteries, which I like.  Supposedly waterproof.  Magellan sells a handlebar mount for it so I'm wondering if I should snag one before they change the design and can't find one:

http://www.magellangps.com/eXplorist-Handlebar-Mount

The GPS and the mount don't get the best reviews but I question the competence and accuracy of the users/reviews.  It is pretty chunky compared to a Garmin Edge but I'm not in the market to go out and buy a new, sleek, lightweight, dedicated cycling GPS.

Then I have a Samsung Galaxy S3 smartphone with ViewRanger GPS app installed and there are many smartphone handlebar mounts available.  ViewRanger doesn't require a cell signal to function (unlike Google Maps and some others) so you can venture away from civilization.  The good thing is that if you do have cell/data service, you have the full capability of a smartphone available to you.  The bad thing is keeping the Li-Ion battery charged.  I've never tested how long I can run it with only the GPS app running but I highly doubt it would come close to 16hrs.  I would have to carry a spare battery pack or rig some other charging solution.

If you had to choose between the 2, which would it be?  That will dictate what mount I buy.  As I mentioned above, I know there are newer GPS units out there but that is out-of-budget at this time.  I want to try to make what I have work.  Or do I buy a mount for each and run the smartphone when I know I'll have a signal and fair weather and run the Magellan when the weather is questionable and the route is away from cell service?

Thanks!      

I'm a little late to the dance but another vote for standard 29er tubes.  I just mounted 29x3 Panaracer FatBNimble tires and used tubes that went up to 2.5".  I tried to order legit 29+ tubes from the LBS but they flubbed the order so I decided to give the biggest standard tubes a try.  The guy commented that the Trek 29+ bikes came with the standard tubes he was handing me.  They are much easier to find and are around 50% cheaper than a dedicated 29x3 tube. 

I'm exploring my options for a frame bag on my Surly Ogre (size - Large).  I see that Revelate makes a cobranded bag that offers a very custom fit.  However, when I look at those images versus the Revelate Ranger bag, the cobranded bag looks like it is one giant compartment (with some internal organization) where the Ranger has a lower compartment, an upper compartment, map pouch on the left side, and a hydration tube port.  The Ranger seems like a much nicer bag for nearly the same money.

I was hoping someone may be able to confirm what I'm seeing and could comment on what seems to work better.  I'm leaning toward the Ranger bag, or one very similar to that design from another builder.

Thanks! 

I just wanted to follow-up.  After much digging, I learned that the Panaracer Fat B Nimble 29x3" tire runs on the narrow side.  When mounted on a 35mm rim, I have seen evidence that they fit in the rear triangle of an Ogre with a little room to spare.  If you ended up completely caked with mud you may have a problem with clearance but most of my riding will be dry gravel.  I have 2 Fat B Nimbles in the basement.  Now I need the LBS to deliver on the tubes I need (I should have just ordered online).

I'll post some pics once they are mounted.

I'm hoping to make the last push to finish my bikepacking/all-in-one bike and need to make some decisions about tires.  Here's the build:

Frame - Surly Orge
Fork - Salsa Enabler
Rims - Velocity Blunt 35 29er
Hub (fr) - Hope Pro II Single Speed rear hub
Hub (rr) - Shimano Alfine 8 IGH

Here is how I plan to use it:

40% - gravel
40% - rough pavement
20% - light trail/XC

My plan is to swap out the tires depending on the trip but most of my riding will be on the gravel roads around my house and pavement into town to run errands.  For my main tires, I'm looking to mount the fattest tires the frame will accept (2.5" or less), something that rolls easy on gravel/pavement, and can provide some cushion.  Tires on my short list:

Schwalbe Super Moto 2.35 - smooth rolling, reports that they do decent on packed singletrack, not cheap
Continental X-King 2.4 - I've read that they roll decently well on pavement despite being a trail tires
Schwalbe Big Apple 2.35 - heavy, don't need the reflective stripe but are essentially the heavyweight brother to the Super Moto


Any other fat, sub-2.5", 29er tires I should consider?

Thanks!


 

I'm building a versatile "all around" bikepacking bike inspired by this build:

http://www.englishcycles.com/custombikes/black-rainbow-divide-ride/

I like the logic behind being able to swap the wheels if needed.  I've dabbled with single speeds before and it would be nice to switch things around without having a dedicated SS bike.  This being said, if you were building an ultimate 29er bikepacking wheelset, what hubs would you use?  I already have a Surly Ogre frame with a Salsa Enabler fork (135mm). 

Right now my thoughts are internal gear hub (e.g. Alfine for one and a Hope Tech SS hub for the other.  Like the bike above, it gives you 2 drivetrains in a single bike that can be used at any time.  Thoughts?

Thanks! 

Yes, still available.

I picked up a Surly Ogre frameset last year and immediately went with a Salsa Enabler fork.  Rather than keep the Ogre fork around with an unrealistic vision that I will use it someday, I'd rather send it to a new home.

This is a brand new, uncut, never mounted, never tampered with, only taken out of the box twice, 2014 Surly Ogre fork.  It has all of the attachment points for carriers, racks and fenders and can accept a 29x3.0" tire to make your 29er a more versatile bikepacking rig.  More specs here:

surlybikes.com/parts/forks/ogre_fork   

Asking $100 shipped.  Please PM me if interested.  Also posted on local classified sites.  First person to put cash in my hand/account takes it.

I'm finally shifting my stable around and have added a Surly Ogre frame that will be built up with parts from another rig and as money/time allow.  I was looking forward to trying a Jones Loop Bar on this rig but it appears that Jones no longer makes a 25.4mm clamp diameter variant.  The stem I have is a Thomson Elite 25.4mm in like-new condition so it is hard to justify ditching it just to go to a 31.8mm clamp diameter.

I'm curious what others are finding to work well for attaching lights and other accessories?  Are flat bars better than risers?  I have a couple riser bars but in most cases, you lose the real estate at the bends for attaching anything.

Or should I just suck it up and drop the coin on a new stem and go with a Jones?

Thanks!

Considering something like a Revelate or Porcelain Rocket is $160-180, how cost effective is making your own bag with similar fabric and features?  I'm curious if there is significant savings or if it is more about going custom. 

I learned a long time ago that building your own stuff (bikes, fishing rods) rarely saves you money overall (even when assuming your time is free), it simply gives you the features you want out of the gate.

Just curious what experienced builders have to say!

Thanks!   

zuren, what'd you end up doing?

I am seriously considering the Ogre myself. I have a CrossCheck right now and am thinking of getting something more "mountainy". Just curious how others that like/ride Surlys are getting on.

I haven't done anything yet due to continued research and finances won't allow it at the moment.  The Karate Monkey has a couple strikes against it.  I read several reviews where the KM has a harsher ride than other potential models I'm considering like the Soma Juice.  There are also some issues removing the rear wheel on 2011 and earlier KM's with disc brakes (supposedly remedied after 2011 but apparently there is still a "trick").  Since I'm considering fatter tires (2.4"+) and maybe even a suspension seat post (e.g. Thudbuster), I'm not sure the stiffer ride will matter much.  I may want to see a KM first to play with removing a rear wheel.  The Ogre gets away from this by moving the caliper mounting point inside the triangle.  My interest may be shifting back toward the Ogre.  

I read other reviews where some complained that sliding dropouts can slip and creak on the Soma.  This would drive me crazy.  I'm getting rid of an EBB singlespeed frame due to the creaking.

I continue my quest for a new frame that falls into more of a do-it-all roll and can take on bikepacking duties.  I've been comparing offerings from Surly (Ogre, Karate Monkey), Salsa (El Mariachi), Soma (Juice) and On-One (Inbred 29er Slot).

I already have a Salsa Enabler fork and was looking closer at the Surly Karate Monkey vs. the Ogre.  I don't plan to ever invest in a Rohloff hub, won't use rim brakes, probably will never pull a trailer, and already have a fork with braze-on's so many of the main selling points of the Ogre would never be utilized.  The fewer features and lower cost of a Karate Monkey (w/o canti bosses) is becoming more attractive and used options seem to be more plentiful.  It appears both frames can easily accept racks and I would probably go with clamp-on fenders even if there were braze-ons.  Are there any other subtle differences between these two that I'm not seeing or considering?

Overall I think I've arrived at my list of "must haves" for a potential frame:

- cost effective (Salsa is probably out of my budget; Surly hits a middle point)
- simpler is better
- clearance for 29er x 2.4-2.5" tires
- large main triangle for frame bag

The Karate Monkey seems to hit all of these (particularly a used one) but wanted to gather some more feedback.

http://surlybikes.com/bikes/karate_monkey/bike_info

Thanks!     

His story wasn't all that exciting. He just said that he pressed on the pedals and torqued it (I don't necessarily believe it).

That's a BS story if I ever heard one, unless his pressing on the pedals happened after he nearly tore the derailleur off the bike on a rock.  I can think of a lot of other components that would grenade before the hanger would bend.

I posted in another thread about packable fishing rods; can't remember where that was so I will contribute here as well.  I'm intrigued by EMMRODs for bikepacking/canoeing/backpacking adventures:

http://www.emmrod.com/

The "rod" portion separates from the handle to stow it away.  I've never seen one in person to offer any real experience but like the concept.

(no affiliation with this company)