GPS

[Majcolo]

Ok, I have next to no experience with GPS. Old school, I know.

I have been given a free 2005ish Garmin eTrex Legend C. Is it worth me buying the maps for this unit, or do I need to pony up for a new Vista HCX + maps or an Oregon? Are the maps transferrable between units, so that if I buy the maps then upgrade the unit after I don't need to rebuy the maps? Can I use any of TopoFusion's maps as a substitute for the Garmin maps?

Thanks in advance for any advice.

[daveB]

I haven't used my Garmin for a long time, but here are some tips:

I'm pretty sure that TopoFusion maps are bitmap files that won't work gracefully on a GPS unit.  You want GPS specific vector maps.  A couple of free sources:
http://www.gpsfiledepot.com/
http://www.miscjunk.org/mj/mp_main.html

Garmin's Topo DVD also works, but isn't free.

Any of these maps are installed on your computer initially, then the parts you want can be uploaded via Garmin MapSource to the GPS, so yes, they are transferable to another GPS unit.

[Pivvay]

And don't sweat the maps either. For following a track, you don't need anything extra but the track GPX file. Upload and follow the arrow.

It takes some time to get the hang of the GPS quirks but it's worth the initial PITA factor.

[ScottM]

Maps on the unit aren't necessary, but they do help for following the uploaded track since they give a sense of scale to things (for example, you can see how far it was back that you crossed the last road).  I find it a bit annoying to follow a blank map with a track, but it does work.

LegendC should work just find.  You wouldn't gain too much going to a VistaHCx, unless you are riding in a lot of tree cover, but the difference is not huge.

[Majcolo]

Thanks for that info. I have now just scratched the surface of a whole new level of map geekdom! (I decorate my walls with maps, I am a card-carrying map geek.) I have a much greater appreciation for TopoFusion now Scott. Thanks again for the Black Friday sale.

It looks like the critical limiter on the Legend C is the lack of an SD slot, making it impractical for long routes like TU which is my goal for the year. Unless someone has a good workaround for that problem?

I'm guessing after Christmas will be a good time to be Oregon shopping.

[AZTtripper]

Thanks for that info. I have now just scratched the surface of a whole new level of map geekdom! (I decorate my walls with maps, I am a card-carrying map geek.) I have a much greater appreciation for TopoFusion now Scott. Thanks again for the Black Friday sale.

It looks like the critical limiter on the Legend C is the lack of an SD slot, making it impractical for long routes like TU which is my goal for the year. Unless someone has a good workaround for that problem?

I'm guessing after Christmas will be a good time to be Oregon shopping.

Lack of an SD slot won't stop you from loading a long route/track and following it. What you won't be able to do is track yourself at a very high resolution. I think the limiting factor is the 10,000 track point limit and that is the same for both Legend and Vista, C or HCx. TopoFusion can simplify tracks as well as segment them to fit the 20x500 system used by Garmin. I have the pro version not sure is the lower one's do or not, but usually the race directors post a version that loads right up for you.

Go with the free map sources it is nice to have some background info to help with navigation.

The Legend C will work fine I was happy with mine until it died (too many days on the bars)(it did the AZT800, AZT300 and many days rides) I have the Legend HCx now. The only thing the disc slot gets you is more room to store active tracks I set mine to make a track point every second so the file gets big fast. On longer rides the active log overfills and the only way to get the track is off of the card but I get a very detailed track.

[Majcolo]

Wow that is great info, thanks. I have TopoFusion Pro but haven't tried playing around with track splitting in it yet. The track that DH has made available for TU is 16k+ points, but with 10k points loaded and some hard copy maps it sounds like I'll be fine after all.

I imagine the real art here is splitting the track into high-res sections where there are a lot of turns and low-res sections where there are few turns. I downloaded the free SW US 100k topo and 24MB is not enough memory to load every quad of the current TU route.

[ScottM]

Simplfying/splitting tracks is all taken care of by TF, and it does so optimally (keeps detail in twisty areas, etc).  The 500x20 limit for uploaded tracks does apply to all the units AZTtripper mentioned, so you'll have no problem with room for the track you follow.

The lack of a data card slot does limit how many maps you can upload and I'm not surprised 24mb didn't fit all of TU.  The official Garmin maps (from the Topo 2008 DVD) are smaller (less detailed) than the free ones and they would likely fit for anything in the ~500 mile or less range.  Unfortunately that DVD costs money, so that's the downside there.

[Majcolo]

That sounds like a great feature Scott, I'll play with it some more this week.

Unfortunately that DVD costs money, so that's the downside there.

Agreed. Finding a good price on a Oregon between now and TU seems smarter than dropping $120 on nearly out of date tech. Plus I'll get a little gadget consolidation which is always a good thing.

[DaveH]

usually the race directors post a version that loads right up for you.

That has become impractical.  If everyone used older Garmins it would be a layup, but with the Delormes and newer Garmins there isn't a one size fits all method.  A 20x500 works on the Vista but not the 60CS, and on the new Garmin units the user would have to enable each of the 20 tracks - it's easier to have one big track. 

Of course TopoFusion alleviates all these issues.  Track simplifying & splitting works great and is fast/easy.

[DaveH]

That sounds like a great feature Scott, I'll play with it some more this week.

Agreed. Finding a good price on a Oregon between now and TU seems smarter than dropping $120 on nearly out of date tech. Plus I'll get a little gadget consolidation which is always a good thing.

Hate to be the bearer of bad news, but the Oregon camera downright sucks.  I hardly use it anymore, pics come out grainy and green in this spectacular red desert region.  That just ain't right so the olympus comes along if I want pics for the day.

[ScottM]

On the subject of Oregons and tracks, Garmin is stepping up their track navigating game:

http://garmin.blogs.com/softwareupdates/2009/12/getting-more-out-of-track-navigation.html

Only in beta and only for the Oregon right now, but it sounds interesting.

[AZTtripper]

That has become impractical.  If everyone used older Garmins it would be a layup, but with the Delormes and newer Garmins there isn't a one size fits all method.  A 20x500 works on the Vista but not the 60CS, and on the new Garmin units the user would have to enable each of the 20 tracks - it's easier to have one big track. 

Of course TopoFusion alleviates all these issues.  Track simplifying & splitting works great and is fast/easy.

Agreed TF works great on this I had no trouble making my own versions of the Coco 250 I got it all loaded up just in time to see that Scott had just posted the whole thing already split. It was good practice tho.

[Majcolo]

Hate to be the bearer of bad news, but the Oregon camera downright sucks.  I hardly use it anymore, pics come out grainy and green in this spectacular red desert region.  That just ain't right so the olympus comes along if I want pics for the day.

That is seriously disappointing, but thanks for the heads up. Sounds like a software problem, maybe they'll fix it between now and next summer.

[stevage]

> Sounds like a software problem, maybe they'll fix it between now and next summer.

Nah, hardware for sure. I don't see how you could expect to cram a tiny little piece of electronics into an already heavily loaded gizmo and expect great pics. I've seen the results on the web. Fine for "proof I was there" type photos, bad for anything more than that. I still expect it to be useful for mapping out new tracks, taking photos of the surface etc. (My oregon 550 has finally been shipped at least...it's a long wait.)

[ScottM]

BTW, the Dakota is a little cheaper option than the Oregon.  I posted some thoughts on mine after 2 months of use:

http://www.topofusion.com/diary/2009/12/16/garmin-dakota-20-review/

[stevage]

Yeah, I know. But has 60% less pixels, from memory. I'm a huge pixel person. Probably a good option for a lot of people though.

[ScottM]

True, less pixels, but it's part of why the screen is more visible in daylight.  It can be a good thing, in other words.

[stevage]

Sure. Well, my Oregon 550 finally arrived this morning. Solid looking unit! Hard to comment on visibility until it's actually on the bike. When the sun hits it, it's just a sheet of white, but that probably goes for most gps'es. Otherwise, the screen does look dim, but still readable.

I actually ordered the same screen protector as an earlier poster, but due to<long story short>didn't receive it. Good to hear that it didn't do much about glare, I might try a different brand.