Hub dynamo and electronics thread.

[vulpes_vulpes]

I'm trying to decide between a pd-8 and a pd-8x hub. It sounds to me like a lot of people are successfully using a pd-8 with 29" wheelsets, but the pd-8x is meant to be more efficient at the larger wheelsize?

I'm running Surly Knards at 29x3" on an ECR. Will the pd-8 work for me? I'm looking to charge a single device at a time (sometimes a cache battery)

[Lentamentalisk]

My understanding of PD-8X is that it is thru axle? Perhaps I'm confused on the mater though.

[vulpes_vulpes]

My understanding of PD-8X is that it is thru axle? Perhaps I'm confused on the mater though.

This is true, but there is an efficiency difference between the pd-8 and pd-8x as well. I am not clear if this is substancial enough to justify the cost. I am going to be using a quick release either way (pd-8x comes equipped with a 15mm adapter to 9mm qr)

[Yogi the Barry]

I originally had the PD-8 [9mm QR axle, paired with a 29er Crest rim]. Sold it when I had to build up a 15mm TA wheel. The PD-8 does NOT work with a 15mm axle. The PD-8X is a bit heavier than the 8, but it comes with an adapter to make it also work with 9mm QR axle. According to SP's web site, the 8X is more efficient at low speeds than the 8. I think the 8X also uses larger wheel bearings, which should increase its life. I just finished the AZT300 using the PD-8X laced up with a Crest 29er rim on an Ripley LS. Worked great. Can't honestly say that I perceived the 8X to come on sooner than the 8... maybe... Being able to use the 8X on either QR or 15mm axles is worth it, IMHO... Only negative of the 8X over the 8 - I wanted the new 8X to be red like my original 8, but could only find it in black...

I'm trying to decide between a pd-8 and a pd-8x hub. It sounds to me like a lot of people are successfully using a pd-8 with 29" wheelsets, but the pd-8x is meant to be more efficient at the larger wheelsize?

I'm running Surly Knards at 29x3" on an ECR. Will the pd-8 work for me? I'm looking to charge a single device at a time (sometimes a cache battery)

[vulpes_vulpes]

Thanks! I decided to run a pd-8 since it is so much more affordable and it seems the claimed 6% increase in efficiency isn't easy to notice

[rick miller]

Anybody use a dialectic grease such as http://www.amazon.com/Permatex-22058-Dielectric-Tune-Up-Grease/dp/B000AL8VD2  for making semi-permanent usb connections (ie. hot glue) for better contact and waterproofing?

[Yogi the Barry]

Edit: Forgive me, I'm a materials science geek
...or the $1.50 packets of 'bulb', 'battery terminal' or 'ignition wire/spark plug' grease you can find at your local auto parts store. I think all of those grease packets are blends of silicone and grease. The 'spark plug' grease is probably more silicone grease and less petroleum jelly. BTW, Vaseline works just fine on battery terminals. As a high-tech fluorinated surrogate, there are quite a few Krytox formulations which would work.

Anybody use a dialectic grease such as http://www.amazon.com/Permatex-22058-Dielectric-Tune-Up-Grease/dp/B000AL8VD2  for making semi-permanent usb connections (ie. hot glue) for better contact and waterproofing?

[bakerjw]

I think the 8X also uses larger wheel bearings, which should increase its life.

They both use the same bearings. I'm going around with them on a warranty out of the box. They are trying to convince me to go with the PD-8 even though I explained that I have 15mm through axle forks. On a side note, they will replace the defective unit if I send it to Taiwan.

[Yogi the Barry]

I haven't peered inside their hubs, but I wonder how hard it would be to replace/rebuild the [6XXX?] bearings? Pure speculation, but if you're good with a soldering iron, as in able to replace discrete components on a printed circuit board, there's probably only two [very fine wire] joints to unsolder/solder. An option to avoid if you're working a warranty issue. However, it you are out of warranty, don't want to ship an entire wheel, or unlace a whole wheel to ship the hub only, then there's not much to lose trying the DIY approach...
-Barry

They both use the same bearings. I'm going around with them on a warranty out of the box. They are trying to convince me to go with the PD-8 even though I explained that I have 15mm through axle forks. On a side note, they will replace the defective unit if I send it to Taiwan.

[Yogi the Barry]

A FAQ quote off of IntelligentDesignCycles.com website, regarding SP bearing service... I have no idea if the $30 is true or not...
How often do SP hub dynamos require service?
SP hub dynamos employ sealed bearings that do not require service until the bearings are require replacement. We already have customers that have logged over 10,000 kms without any problems and we expect that under normal use the service life of these bearings should be well over 20,000 kms. Should they ever need servicing, they can be sent back to SP and replaced with new ones for roughly USD 30 including the cost of return postage.

[bakerjw]

Charlie at Intelligent Design cycles is a decent person that understands customer service. I have had several e-mail's go back and forth with him.

As for the people at Shutter Precision.... I will bite my tongue for now.

[Briansong]

Is there any forum experience charging Shimano Di2 battery off a Son28? I've sold my Rohloff and am replacing it with gears. I am convinced that I want to try the electronic stuff. I also think the battery may last the entire TD route, done in a reasonable time. I know Mike Hall did it on one battery but his time would be at least a week faster than mine. I believe he had a spare battery in his seat tube IIRC.

Cant find any definitive answers on line. Peter White had no idea. (That was interesting )

[bmike-vt]

Does it charge via USB? Then likely yes, if you get enough power to it during daylight hours. 2 batteries would likely make the entire course, so charging might be for insurance.


Note the hub won't charge anything without the right intermediary - USBwerk or similar needs to be used to get the power to the battery.

I've charged my Exposure Diablo, a GoPro, run my etrex20, iPhone, and a Limefuel battery. Not all at once, but they all charge or run via USB.

[Yogi the Barry]

PD-8X update:
In the fall of 2015, I started using a Shutter Precision PD-8X laced up for my Ripley LS. I continued to use the hub on my Ripley for all of 2016. I didn't log the day and night training hours, but it was a lot. I'm guessing I logged over 3000 miles in 2016 alone, including a 24-hr race, AZT 300 and CTR. The wheel is now on my Ti hardtail winter commuter. No issues. But YMMV.

...As for the people at Shutter Precision.... I will bite my tongue for now.

[Briansong]

Does it charge via USB? Then likely yes, if you get enough power to it during daylight hours. 2 batteries would likely make the entire course, so charging might be for insurance.


Note the hub won't charge anything without the right intermediary - USBwerk or similar needs to be used to get the power to the battery.

I've charged my Exposure Diablo, a GoPro, run my etrex20, iPhone, and a Limefuel battery. Not all at once, but they all charge or run via USB.

Thanks Mike, I am using a USBWerks and also have charged many devices like yours. The Di2 was an unknown and I wasn't finding any answers anywhere. If it stumped Peter White, I got a bit concerned. The charge indicator lights give you plenty of warning. There are 4 states of charge indicated by the lights. I figure to have time to charge it in many places. I will also have time during my home riding and training time to learn the batteries capabilities. I would hate to carry a spare battery if I can keep from it.

Steve

[bmike-vt]

It really should work like any other device, its just a battery...

[Briansong]

Agree, that was my thinking. But...I looked for a definitive yes-no and found a bike forum that there was a two page argument going about it. They were arguing about the Dynamo hub being a generator or a magneto. I agree it should be just a simple "yes" but with a major component manufacturer like Shimano, they might have taken some weird power output path to keep all components "at home"

I try to keep things as simple as possible.

Take care,

Steve

[DoctorRad]

Biggest problem with SPs is that you can't work on the bearings and Ollie Whalley had his pack up at 7000 km - others have not had an issue.

When you say you can't work on the bearings, I assume they're standard cartridge bearings? Can you expose the seals? If so, it should be possible to carefully lift the seals and put better grease into the bearings, which should increase their service life. The grease in most cartridge bearings used on bike parts is totally inadequate for the job - I refer to it as 'photocopier grade'.

[evdog]

Question for those running dynamos - are you able to use the hub to power a GPS unit that runs off AA batteries?  I have a Garmin Oregon 600. 

I presume I would not be able to power the GPS directly because the power would cut off soon after the wheels stop spinning.  But perhaps if I carry a couple portable chargers I can use one to power GPS while the other one charges. 

Also, does anyone know if the more popular dynamo hubs like Son 28 and SP have the ability to swap out end caps to be able to swap the wheel between forks with normal 100mm spacing vs 110mm boost forks?  My hardtail has 15x100, and I may upgrade my full susp bike, but many seem to come with boost forks now.  A dynamo wheel for each is definitely not in the budget!

Any thoughts would be appreciated. 

[Oilcanracer]

Question for those running dynamos - are you able to use the hub to power a GPS unit that runs off AA batteries?  I have a Garmin Oregon 600. 

I presume I would not be able to power the GPS directly because the power would cut off soon after the wheels stop spinning.  But perhaps if I carry a couple portable chargers I can use one to power GPS while the other one charges. 

Also, does anyone know if the more popular dynamo hubs like Son 28 and SP have the ability to swap out end caps to be able to swap the wheel between forks with normal 100mm spacing vs 110mm boost forks?  My hardtail has 15x100, and I may upgrade my full susp bike, but many seem to come with boost forks now.  A dynamo wheel for each is definitely not in the budget!

Any thoughts would be appreciated. 

The best way to run these dyno hubs is to have a cashe battery pack in between the hub and what you are using /charging. That way power is never interrupted.

My hub came with a qr or 100 hub conversion,  so 110 should be doable.   Check their website for exact info.