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  Topic Name: New Bikepacker. From Surly LHT -> To ??? on: August 02, 2018, 01:05:33 PM
Dubbed743


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« on: August 02, 2018, 01:05:33 PM »

Interested in trying out bikepacking and looking for recommendations:

I currently ride a 2008 Surly LHT with Smart Sam half knobbies and and an ebay seat post suspension that works quite well on mild offroad, but I'm tired of racking my junk when things get gnarlier.

I've never had anything but a hard steel frame, however after trying my mother's (comically small) Trek Carbon Lush I'm now sold on full suspension.

From my limited research, it looks like +/- 40L is the realistic combined maximum storage volume with a bikepacking setup using a handlebar bag, triangle bag, and seat bag. Unfortunately this is not sufficient volume for where I live (high Sierras - it snowed a few weeks ago in July), so need to explore what my options are.

- Is it possible to mount a front or rear rack on a full suspension bike? I understand there is likely to be interference with a traditional style mount, but has anyone overcome this? If so, what full suspension bikes come with rack mount points?

- Besides carrying a backpack, are there any not annoying ways to get beyond 40L without using racks?

- I'd like to keep my LHT as it is, but could it be that my best bet just to swap handlebars and put some genetic material in the fridge if I ever want to have kids?

I say this with reservation, but price is not my number 1 concern.... If it costs $5,000 to make what I want work, than that's acceptable.

Respectfully, I'm not interested in hearing "pack less" as a solution - I've spent many days on the PCT and know exactly what I need to survive and have an enjoyable experience.

Thanks in Advance!

Hopefully the pic shows up of my LHT in day-use mode:

« Last Edit: August 02, 2018, 01:12:47 PM by Dubbed743 » Logged

  Topic Name: New Bikepacker. From Surly LHT -> To ??? Reply #1 on: August 03, 2018, 06:51:52 AM
Marc40a


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« Reply #1 on: August 03, 2018, 06:51:52 AM »

Welcome.

Unlike hikers, bikepackers don't really think in terms of litres, so that kind of explains the lack of responses so far.

Would you consider a fat bike? or 29+ in lieu of full suspension? That opens a lot of options for both front and back racks as well as generously sized frame bags.

With the rear rack... I'm thinking that you would probably want to strap a voluminous drybag to the top as opposed to any kind of pannier set up, though, maybe mini panniers might work - definitely not traditional-style ortliebs.
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  Topic Name: New Bikepacker. From Surly LHT -> To ??? Reply #2 on: August 03, 2018, 11:47:53 AM
Dubbed743


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« Reply #2 on: August 03, 2018, 11:47:53 AM »

Thanks for the reply!

I find it interesting that liters are not commonly used to describe how much gear one has (especially when drysacks do all the measuring work for you), but I guess that explains why I was having such difficulty finding volume measurements when looking over gear lists?

RE fatbike, I find that with no other suspension, the undamped rebound of the fat tires felt a bit offputting from my few test rides. I'm sure it's something I could get used to, but coming from the dirt bike enduro would, full suspension feels much more natural to me.  

I did some googling and I found a company called Old Man Mountain (OMM) who make a line of front and rear racks called the Sherpa that supposedly work with FS bikes due to their unique mount points. I'm going to do more research, but maybe someone here has experience with them? Also, I was thinking along the same lines as you that a single drybag (or bear canister) on top of the rear rack would be a better solution than low hanging panniers.

Also here is an example of one of my favorite local trails that I would love to be able to ride with a pedal bike (and why I was initially drawn to something with FS). Unfortunately I have to turn around with the Surly LHT far before this point.




Unlike what I would guess is the majority of bikepackers, after muscling a 400lb loaded dirt bike around, an extra few pounds here or there is more or less irrelevant to me - as long as my frame stays in one piece I am perfectly happy averaging 4mph. If I can get the rack situation to work, I'm guessing my type of riding will be best suited by one of the newer 29+ FS  bikes (for reference I'm 6'1" athletic build):
http://dirtragmag.com/first-impression-lenz-sport-behemoth-29plus/
http://www.bikepacking.com/news/2018-salsa-deadwood/
https://www.trekbikes.com/us/en_US/bikes/mountain-bikes/trail-mountain-bikes/full-stache/full-stache-8/p/22688/?colorCode=greendark_greenvisibility
« Last Edit: August 03, 2018, 11:55:15 AM by Dubbed743 » Logged

  Topic Name: New Bikepacker. From Surly LHT -> To ??? Reply #3 on: August 03, 2018, 12:58:50 PM
Marc40a


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« Reply #3 on: August 03, 2018, 12:58:50 PM »

Those are some cool bikes, for sure. You may not even need plus size tires. A 2.2  -2.6" 29er tire has  good size footprint and rotates pretty quickly.

Any objections to wearing a backpack or is that space already reserved for a hydration pack?

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  Topic Name: New Bikepacker. From Surly LHT -> To ??? Reply #4 on: August 03, 2018, 01:30:01 PM
Dubbed743


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« Reply #4 on: August 03, 2018, 01:30:01 PM »

So just to clarify, a 29er is (roughly) 2.2"-2.6" and a 29+ is 2.6"-3.0"? Things sure have changed in the past 10 years since I bought my LHT haha.

I like the concept of additional grip from a fatter tire at lower PSI (even at the expense of additional rotating mass), but I think you are right that since I am mostly dealing with rocks and not sand, the added float probably isn't 100% necessary. It seems like I'd be paying a premium for the 29+ FS over a 29er FS just because they are new to the market.

RE backpack, when riding I typically go 3L Camelback, "shit kit" (AKA trowel/tp/etc), emergency gear (lighter, knife, bivy, paracord, SPOT), and ghost whisperer down jacket.
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  Topic Name: New Bikepacker. From Surly LHT -> To ??? Reply #5 on: August 04, 2018, 07:30:19 AM
KittyOnMyFoot

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« Reply #5 on: August 04, 2018, 07:30:19 AM »

I currently ride a 2008 Surly LHT with Smart Sam half knobbies and and an ebay seat post suspension that works quite well on mild offroad, but I'm tired of racking my junk when things get gnarlier.
I use an adjustable seat post and live by it so much that I personally found it worth packing around it (as in, foregoing a seat pack) to keep that as an option.

I've never had anything but a hard steel frame, however after trying my mother's (comically small) Trek Carbon Lush I'm now sold on full suspension.
I bikepack with a full suspension 29er - it's fine.

where I live (high Sierras - it snowed a few weeks ago in July)
Do tell... I live in the low Sierras (highway 108 corridor).

Is it possible to mount a front or rear rack on a full suspension bike? I understand there is likely to be interference with a traditional style mount, but has anyone overcome this?
Yes - to keep my suspension seat post viable, I went with a rear rack and full panniers. Tons of room (and there's still some room on top of the rack as well). I haven't looked at front panniers yet with the singular exception of a month-long bikepacking trip through Japan. There, however, I brought an older, beater bike that I was "okay" with having lost or stolen (an old 2000 Schwinn Mesa GS), and I finagled a front rack onto that thing. I think Old Man Mountain makes front suspension racks if you're so inclined.

I did some googling and I found a company called Old Man Mountain (OMM) who make a line of front and rear racks called the Sherpa that supposedly work with FS bikes due to their unique mount points. I'm going to do more research, but maybe someone here has experience with them?
Their Sherpa is what I use. Besides working with the full suspension, it does two things for me: 1) if the seat post can't get my butt low enough for a drop, I will hang trou over my rear tire. While I don't sit on the rack, it does let me get very far down without my shorts catching on my tire. 2) This bike, like several other full-suspension ones apparently, suffered from pretty severe brake judder. Apparently many people went after trying to tune their brakes to fix this, but this judder comes from harmonic resonance up the seat stays when braking (as it sends some force directly up them and into the shock for this design). The Old Man Mountain rack clamps onto the seat stays in the middle, which broke that resonance, and cured the judder. They're built pretty well... I hauled an oak tree stump off a mountain with it once.

Besides carrying a backpack
I finally got rid of mine when I found a handlebar bag that comes with a water bladder. This got the water off my back and my rack got my tools off my back, and it's sooooo refreshing to ride packless. For all these reasons, that rear rack never comes off. The handlebar bag, by the way, is actually a fanny pack that came with a fitted water bag that has loop fasteners on the bottom with side-mount tension straps. This allows me to hang the pack upside down from the bars without fuss, where all the things that were on my back go now.
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