July Trans-Alp Trip

[gairym]

Hello all,

This is my first post here and so let me know if I'm doing something wrong or not putting things where they're supposed to be etc...

Basically.....I'm planning on doing a 10 day Trans-Alp bikepacking trip this July.

Fully self-supported and picking up food in local shops to be cooked when the evening camp is set-up.

I'm planning on following (roughly) the basic Albrecht route (Garmisch, Germany to Lake Largo, Italy).

I've done loads of touring before, been mountain biking for over 15 years and have even (unknowingly - I thought I'd invented the idea) been bikepacking before (by throwing my DD-Hammock in my Camelbak and spending the night out) but this will be my first long-distance multi-day epic and so I was hoping to get some experience-based-knowledge from your good selves.

What I'm interested in knowing is.....

- Has anyone here done this route before? Or any Trans-Alp route for that matter?

- Is it any good? This Albrecht fella seems to know his stuff and has planned this route to be almost 100% rideable but.....I'm concerned this means that it won't be technical enough - is that true?

- Does anyone know the situation re: wild-camping in the Alps??? I'm not overly concerned if it's not allowed as I'm planning on doing it anyway but it's good to know!

- I've got new kit ideas (as I think a tent/bivi makes more sense than a hammock for when there aren't any trees around) but does anyone have any 'must have' kit suggestions for a trip like this?

Finally, I've been planning on doing this solo but if anyone was interested in joining in then I'd be happy to offer pick-up/drop-off from anywhere in the Lyon, Geneva, Grenoble, Valence region (I British but now live in the Ardeche Mountains, France - very nice riding!).

Sorry for the huge first post but I'm planning a lot and want to get this trip right.

Thanks in advance for any/all assistance and advice and I look forward to being a part of this forum and getting out there bikepacking.

Cheers, Gairy.

[sub-xero]

Hey Gairy,

have you been to the Alps before? Anyway, The Albrecht route is a good choice. It is not too hard and still leads you through beautiful mountain areas. I think your plan sounds exciting and I will give you some hints.

I reckon that you will sleep outside and want to cook your own food. Also I understand that you will use a backpack, since bike bags cannot be used on this route. I also think that it would be good to use a full suspension bike, although it is not obligatory.
Due to your plan of sleeping outside and cooking, you will have to carry some extra baggage, which means extra weight in your backpack. I would recommend to plan your equipment carefully and leave out what you do not absolutely need. Carrying a backpack that weighs more than 10 kg will not be fun anymore, cause it would be a hindrance on trails. You could consider leaving the cooking equipment at home to save some weight (that's how I do it). Besides, open fire is an absolute no-go in the Alps, but a small camping stove should be tolerable.

Speaking of laws: You already know that wild camping is not allowed. The law is the following (let me quote from my own website):

Officially wild camping is prohibited in all European countries. The laws differ a little, but the basic rules are similar everywhere: Wild camping on private property is considered trespassing will be punished. [...] In Austria, wild camping is in general prohibited. If you get caught, it can be very expensive (up to 500 EUR). If you get caught camping in a nature reserve in Austria, the fine will be extremely high. Bivouacing in case of emergency may be tolerated. In Switzerland it is allowed to camp if nothing is damaged or littered, and if it isn't prohibited. In Italy, wild camping in general is prohibited and will be punished.

My experience is that if you keep a low profile, travel alone, keep off the main trails when camping, keep off private property and do lot leave any damage or litter, you can get away with it. Nobody might even notice that you are there. If the Alpine Rescue Service mistakes you as a hiker in distress and starts a rescuing party, you have to pay for it. One more reason not to light a fire.

You should watch the weather carefully, cause even in summer there can be snow in the Alps and you don't want to be outside in your sleeping bag when it has several degrees below zero and a storm front is passing above your head. The weather will be less of a problem as soon as you pass the Alpine Divide and reach Italy. (Which basically means, the first 3 days of your tour are the most critical.)

About the route: It really should be 100% ridable (with minor exceptions), and it contains several technical passages where you will have fun with a mountain bike. It also is very well documented and you can find GPS tracks on the internet. So I think it is a good choice with no risk.

About the equipment, check my website for detailed information. Equipment always varies, depending on your personal needs, but I tried to describe why I carry certain pieces with me. You decide what is useful for you.

If you really wish to camp outside I'd absolutely recommend to do it solo. It is nearly impossible to keep a low profile if you're with a group. And believe me, if you get caught by rangers or farmers or the mountain rescue, you could get into a lot of trouble. Wild camping in the Alps is nothing you should do with a group (and officially not do at all). In the past, wild campers have caused a lot of damage to nature and wilderness, that's why these strict laws were invented.

I wish you good luck with your tour, and send me an e-mail to keep me updated (for the address, check out my website)!

[gairym]

sub-zero,

thanks for all the really useful info!

i'm just reading through a lot of the info on your site and then i think i may have a few more questions for you (if you don't mind).

cheers, gairy.

[gairym]

Andi,

Great website - you've packed in loads of essential information - thanks so much!

After reading about your 2010 trip I've got a question for you.....

Do you think it would be a good idea for me to ride something similar to your 2010 route?

I ask as when I read your criteria for selecting your 2010 route it read like a wish-list of everything I want out of my trip (riding only - no driving, scenic and high mountain terrain, as much challenging singletrack as possible, avoiding asphalt descents, flexible day plans etc...) and so maybe you could let me know if you think it would be suitable for me?

Here's a short résumé of my biking history/experience to give you more of an idea of my skill level:

- I've done lots of medium-distance self-guided riding in the Alps (French mainly and a little bit in Switzerland) but only day rides from/to resorts (Chamonix, Morzine, Meribel etc...).
- I'm very comfortable map reading and navigating but I will be using paper maps as I don't use GPS.
- I would have 10 days to do this route and so would need to cover less distance/height each day.
- I am in pretty good shape already and so fitness should be no problem.
- I actively seek out technically challenging terrain when choosing bike routes - I am sure I could ride all that this route could throw at me.

So.....is your 2010 route something that you think might be suitable for me???

Thanks so much for all of you help and useful information so far and I appreciate you taking the time to help me in my planning.

Cheers, Gairy.

[sub-xero]

I think the route could be suitable for you. You wouldn't need 10 days. If you take your time 8 days should be more than enough. Most parts of the route can easily be done without GPS if you prepare well and use good maps.
However, if I've seen correctly on your website, you don't ride a full suspension bike. Several of the trails I consider not ridable or pure torture without full suspension. Don't underestimate the trails. There's a reason why they are no popular Transalp routes. Some of them are really freeride trails that are even difficult for hikers.

[gairym]

andi,

ok, that's good to hear.

the reason for allowing 10 days is that i have an on/off knee issue which (if it gets bad) might mean i need to take a rest day or two or.....i might just have shorter days and spend my time sitting back and enjoying the scenery.

as you'll know from the other thread i'm now considering getting a cheap GPS device for the trip. i'm going to take another look at the GPS advice/information on your website but i may well get back to you with more questions once i'm done.

just let me know if you are getting tired of me asking for your assistance (i'll understand that you've got other things to do) but i want you to know that i do very much appreciate your help - you are making my planning a lot easier - thank you!

finally.....i don't ride full-sus but i have always been able to keep up with those riding full-sus on my hardtail. i used to ride full-sus and am easily as fast and capable on my new bike as i ever was with full-bounce - i'd be happy to take my chances as nothing i saw on video made me think that i'd prefer to be on a full-sus bike.

thanks again.

gairy.

[sub-xero]

i'd be happy to take my chances as nothing i saw on video made me think that i'd prefer to be on a full-sus bike.

On video, trails mostly look much easier than they actually are. I 2010 I didn't even film the most difficult sections since filming wasn't my top priority yet.

[gairym]

On video, trails mostly look much easier than they actually are. I 2010 I didn't even film the most difficult sections since filming wasn't my top priority yet.

ok, i totally understand what you mean.

but.....unless you are telling me that it 100% cannot be done on a hardtail bike then i am still happy to give it a go with my knowledge of my bike, it's capabilities and my skills.

[sub-xero]

ok, i totally understand what you mean.

but.....unless you are telling me that it 100% cannot be done on a hardtail bike then i am still happy to give it a go with my knowledge of my bike, it's capabilities and my skills.

I've seen people riding the craziest trails on hardtails. (I was a dedicated hardtail biker myself for a long time.) So I think it can be done one way or the other. I just don't want to be the one to be blamed should you have to push all the way down. Cudos for your toughness! The route is beautiful, it will be a great experience.

[gairym]

don't worry fella - i'm fully aware that you're just helping me out and are in no way responsible for what happens while i'm out there.

it's very helpful for me to be able to chat with someone who's done what i'm planning.

if it turns out that i can't ride lots of it then i'll let you know afterwards that you were right and i was wrong!

[sub-xero]

By the way, as I said, don't rely on the video too much concerning trail description. I have a detailed description of the tour and its trails on my website (since less than a week even in English):
Alpencross 2010 Travelogue
Would you share what equipment you plan to take along? I'm especially curious about what kind of sleeping bag/tent, mat, stove etc. you will use.

[gairym]

ok, here's the provisional kit plan (it may well change as i read more reviews and get more advice):

tent (http://www.amazon.co.uk/Coleman-Rigel-Two-Backpacking-Tent/dp/B000PDHQO0/ref=sr_1_13?s=sports&ie=UTF8&qid=1325968235&sr=1-13)

sleeping bag (http://www.snugpak.com/index.php?MenuID=114-119&ItemID=152)

matt - a cheap foam roll-matt (light and inexpensive)

stove - (http://www.towsure.com/product/Solid_Fuel_Compact_Folding_Camping_Backpacking_Stove) - it's VERY light and works well for one person (i've used them before).

any thoughts....?

[sub-xero]

It is good equipment, no doubt. You still could save some weight by choosing a lighter tent and slepping bag. It all depends on your total baggage, no idea how much you can/want to carry in your backpack.

[gairym]

for sure - it could be lighter but.....that would come at a lot more expense.

all of those items combined come to less than £140 (€160) which is quite cheap!

i've priced up some lighter items and the price goes WAAAAAAY up for only a little weight saving.

and.....i'm planning on taking a backpack and a framepack (http://wildcatgear.co.uk/products/frame-bags/) and so i'm hoping that i can get away with the extra weight (as it won't be on my back) and on my frame the whole bike will probably still be lighter than most light full-sus rigs.

i've been looking at routes etc... and was wondering if you happened to still have the .gpx file for your 2010 trip (so that i can look at the route in 3d etc...)

if you do (and wouldn't mind sharing it) then it would be massively helpful if you could email it to me.

if everything goes according to plan and my trip goes ahead then maybe we should meet up as i figure i owe you a beer/currywurst/kartoffelpuffer (those are the German foods i know and love) as i pass through Munich on my way to Füssen to start my trip???

cheers, gairy.