2009 Coconino Loop Race Thread

[ScottM]

Coconino Loop Race 2009 Results
(preliminary)

	Stage1	Stage2	Stage3	Stage4	GC
Scott Morris	5:12	9:20	8:46	5:28	28:46:00
Chad Brown (SS)	6:06	10:08	8:50	6:24	31:28:00
Rob Brinkerhoff	6:35	11:45	11:00	6:31	35:51:00
Tim McCabe	7:04	12:00	11:43	8:35	39:22:00
Lee Blackwell	7:19	14:20	11:14	7:23	40:16:00
Jean Claude Payen	7:15	scratch
Yuri Bahti	8:15	scratch
Tony Underwood	8:15	scratch
Rob Dennis	9:07	scratch

Thru-riders

David Jones - scratch - Williams, Mile 170

[ScottM]

I got some of those times based on SPOT points, so there will be some adjustments I am sure.  Send me your times and/or GPX files and I'll keep updating the table.

Congrats to all the finishers!

[tRoy]

That was fun to watch over the last few days. Thank you trackleaders, spot and ALL the racers/riders.

[Pivvay]

Wow super cool. How fast do you think the course could go in a single push Scott?

[AZTtripper]

Wow super cool. How fast do you think the course could go in a single push Scott?

At my level this course felt one day shorter then the AZT 300. I should think you could take 10-15 + hours off of your time on the 300.

[Chad B]

Some thoughts on my blog and a few more pictures: http://chadfbrown.blogspot.com/2009/10/blog-post.html

[Chad B]

At my level this course felt one day shorter then the AZT 300. I should think you could take 10-15 + hours off of your time on the 300.

That sounds about right.

Some singlespeed thoughts: I'd recommend a 32x19, maybe even an 18 if you think you could push that on technical terrain. I was spinning out a lot on Stage 1 and 3 with my 32x20, although it was perfect on Stage 3.

[jonesy792]

you bet I'll do the 300, can't wait to line up at parker canyon (this time with less delusions of grandeur)

[Pivvay]

Interesting SS thoughts Chad. Did the unrideable stuff seem unrideable 20 or not?

It's funny, a bigger gear sounds all well and good until you go too big, then it goes horribly wrong really fast. I pushed 32x20 at the AZT300 and I was worried it would be too big but I don't think it was.  I wanted to run a 16t for Tour Divide but I was scarrred. I would have had to bring a lot more mozzi repellent!

The 18t is a lot bigger than the 20t though. If you were thru racing, not stage riding, would you run the 19t still?

[ScottM]

Wow super cool. How fast do you think the course could go in a single push Scott?

28:46, right?   ...

OK, 29:00 ... you can have a 14 minute nap.

I think under 40 is possible.  36 would be nice and tidy number, but seems pretty far fetched to me.  It's hard to say though -- new route and new racing format.  I rode quite differently than I do on thru-rides.

[Chad B]

The 18t is a lot bigger than the 20t though. If you were thru racing, not stage riding, would you run the 19t still?

Therein lies the question. I think I would definitely ride a 19t as a thru racer (18t as a stager). There are some pretty flat sections in the first and last stage:



Either way, you'd want a good light setup to ride some of the techy sections at night and/or route finding on Lime Kiln (as David found out, it's a little tricky at night).

[DaveH]

One interesting aspect of this race format is how much down time there is.  I've done plenty of stage racing - and know if there is 15+ hours of downtime that is a lot of time to eat and drink.  Mile for mile, I know I'd eat a ton more in this format.  Any comments on how that side of the equation worked out?  Did it make water availability a bit more critical?

'spose I could just wait for the blogs, but hey inquiring minds want to know  

[jonesy792]

there is lots of water on the course (for arizona), I ran out on top of mingus but there was a little scummy pond there that was good enough to filter out of

[Pivvay]

Scott, do you think you can apply your new riding somewhat to your thru rides and be faster?

I think under 40 sounds reasonable but it's all BSing until someone gives it a shot. Hopefully next year.

And Chad, at some point you just have to pony up and try the big gear, knowing it may end in flames. Of course that's harder to do on a big race but I'm super curious how much faster someone is on the flatter stuff with an 18t vs a 20t in a racing context with tired legs. Fresh doesn't count.

This bench racing is so fun because there are so many strategies to be tried out and experimented with

[jonesy792]

if I can make it to williams in 52 hours with 12 hours of sleep and a crapload of rest stops then the more experienced of you sure as hell can do 40

[ScottM]

One interesting aspect of this race format is how much down time there is.  I've done plenty of stage racing - and know if there is 15+ hours of downtime that is a lot of time to eat and drink.  Mile for mile, I know I'd eat a ton more in this format.  Any comments on how that side of the equation worked out?  Did it make water availability a bit more critical?

Hey Dave--

In general I over-budgeted both food and water for the camping stage stops.  I thought, like you, that with so much time I would need/want to eat and drink a lot.  I think part of the problem is when you're not super comfortable (someone missed the memo and forgot to deliver the lazy boy recliners to Mingus... not to mention it was pretty cold) it's hard to eat or drink much. 

Still, the last thing I wanted to do was sit around hungry or rationing food, so it was good to have too much.

I found that my body never went into hyper caloric starvation mode, like it usually does on thru-races.  I still ate 75 slices of pizza in Williams, but even riding the last day I didn't have to keep jamming food down my throat every half hour just to keep myself on the bike.  It was nice.

Lotsa water out there, though I did run out coming into Williams.

[ScottM]

Scott, do you think you can apply your new riding somewhat to your thru rides and be faster?

Not really.  After the first stage, I needed a couple hours just to get myself back together again.  Not really sustainable riding, but then the optimal pacing is one of the most interesting unknowns on these things.

I think under 40 sounds reasonable but it's all BSing until someone gives it a shot. Hopefully next year.

For sure.  I am curious how fast I could do it, but it will be hard to resist stage racing it again since it was so much fun.

[Lee Blackwell]

Great race! I have good memories of the feeling of all those places we visited if ever so fleetingly. The stage concept was nice, meeting up at the end of each day.
Lee

[Chad B]

For sure.

Scott, WTF? How many times do I have to coach you! It is fo' shizzle not for sure, or at least fo shu at the bare minimum.

I see us having more stage riders next year and a BBQ at the park (on the Urban Route)....Although next year will not be completely free... a 6-pack of beer gets you into the stage race, thereby securing your free food at the BBQ.  

[ScottM]

Scott, WTF? How many times do I have to coach you! It is fo' shizzle not for sure, or at least fo shu at the bare minimum.

Face it, I'm never going to be hip.

I see us having more stage riders next year and a BBQ at the park (on the Urban Route)....Although next year will not be completely free... a 6-pack of beer gets you into the stage race, thereby securing your free food at the BBQ. 

BBQ -- great idea.  With the shorter final stage people will likely finish close together (as they did this year).  It'd be nice to have a place to park cars nearby though.

As for beer as an entry fee -- forget about it!  Live free or die.