2011 AZTR and 300 planning thread

[ActionJackson]

I paid the price carrying that much and I planned and did a lot of reading up and studying as much as I could. It did work well for me, but it worked me over good. Just hard to pin it all down until you get out there, next time I'll know better, next time, I'll have had some more experience out on the trail.

There's a Circle K (off-route) a few miles away from the bottom of Reddington, just past the golf course. Me and Mark C rolled in there and it was getting hot out. I was inside getting water and Mark made a small camp almost inside the Ice Cooler, I was laughing and wish I got a picture of it.

I did use my filter in the creek at Molino that Tim is talking about. Park your bike and walk up a ways. I was so shattered from the HAB over the saddleback and the long day, that I was fumbling around with my filter.

Tim can correct me on this, but I believe before the Molino HAB, there is a water tank or something before you go over and one or two small ponds coming from Bellota Trail after you cross the gravel road.

Man, the AZT trail is awesome!

Jackson

[AZTtripper]

Yes there is water on the east side of Molino saddle but its the brownish tannin stuff and then you have to carry it all the way up and over as well.

On my 04 trip I had a 9 liter MSR and a 3 liter camel as well as a 2 liter camel. Man I was paranoid back then.

So there are 5 people who have replied to this thread and it feels like a lot considering that for several years there were only 3 of us who seemed to have any interest in riding the real AZT.

[sherpaxc]

Trust me, there is ALOT of interested over here!  If I had the time I would attempt a full thru.  I don't think my principal would like that too much!

[AZTtripper]

That's cool to hear and next year the course should get even better. More ST and a more direct route north of the Gila. Also 2012 is the AZ centennial so the ATA hopes to call it the official year of completion.

[Marshal]

and next year the course should get even better.

Yeah yeah 'even better' sure, right --ha this old man likes the idea of doing it before it gets 'even better'

[AZTtripper]

Yeah yeah 'even better' sure, right --ha this old man likes the idea of doing it before it gets 'even better'

Yeah better is a matter of opinion of course. The big dirt road detour down to the diversion dam and then back to the AZT. As apposed to the new ST around the White Canyon Wilderness. The new route should be shorter mileage wise and the average trail grade should be pretty low. But it's some rough country so travel will not be easy. I have seen several sections some before and some after the ST was built and I can only say wow it's cool up there.

Marshal for an "old man" you have been putting in some pretty respectable times on the 300 course. But yeah I hear you I am only 47 but I do feel it some days. Laddie Cox the guy who has the track for the LOST trail is nearly 80. He was at one time the oldest person to hike all of the AZT in passages. The guy acts like a teenager you just can't get him to stop working on the trail (they put me in charge of getting him back to the campsite) I finally had to tell him he was getting me in trouble and could we please head back.  

[AZTtripper]

I got a copy of the LOST track not sure if Scott will add it to the GPX file or what but I sent it to him. Seems like a good way to get to Superior from the Picketpost TH. Stay on the AZT and cross under the highway to Hewett Station road (same as the 750 course) but turn right and follow the RR tracks signed with Carsonites with LOST Logo and American Flags. 4.5 miles one one quite a bit of it's old 2 track so it might not be that slow going. Crosses back under and then around through Old Pinal Townsite comes out about 1/2 a mile from town by the airport. Might not be quicker then the highway but at least you can stay off of it most of the way.

[Marshal]

I am working on my Phoenix to Payson Profile and am wondering where the best place to get “potable-close to road” water at Roosevelt Lake--Cholla CG or other? 

And also is there a store or good stop for water at Rye (hours)?

Any food/water info on this section is appreciated

[dream4est]

I got water at Apache Junction, Tortilla Flats and Punkin Center. Jakes Corner had a bar I had a coke in at midnight. Then I hit Payson the next day before noon, Rye stuff was closed at 6am. Water is easy to find (and riding is easy and fast until near Pine) from Apache to after Flagstaff. I carried less than the 300 moves like Oracle to AP water cache.

[Marshal]

I got water at Apache Junction, Tortilla Flats and Punkin Center. Jakes Corner had a bar I had a coke in at midnight. Then I hit Payson the next day before noon, Rye stuff was closed at 6am. Water is easy to find (and riding is easy and fast until near Pine) from Apache to after Flagstaff. I carried less than the 300 moves like Oracle to AP water cache.

Thanks for the confirming info on this section.  I am planning for two different traverses of this section.  The 1st is as you did it.  With a bivy past Jake’s Corner I assume?

But the 2nd would begin pre-dawn from Apache Junction, which would mean Tortilla Flats will be closed.  And Roosevelt lake is about 45 miles from Apache Junction, hence my interest in getting convenient water at a CG there.

Anyway, if the temps are reasonable this section should be relatively easy form a resupply and getting-in-miles point of view

Was there much traffic?  I am hoping not to much.

[dream4est]

Thanks for the confirming info on this section.  I am planning for two different traverses of this section.  The 1st is as you did it.  With a bivy past Jake’s Corner I assume?

But the 2nd would begin pre-dawn from Apache Junction, which would mean Tortilla Flats will be closed.  And Roosevelt lake is about 45 miles from Apache Junction, hence my interest in getting convenient water at a CG there.

Anyway, if the temps are reasonable this section should be relatively easy form a resupply and getting-in-miles point of view

Was there much traffic?  I am hoping not to much.

I left Apache very late, like noon, from the bike shop. After a frazzled 300 with 2 days of mechanical delays, I was moving well but not Kurt speed and not as fast as I expect to do it this year.  I would say that someone in shape could make Payson or farther with a pre dawn move from Apache. BTW I only got a short top off in Tortilla and made it easily to Punkin Center with 140oz or so from Tortilla. I didnt need the Tortilla water. Not much traffic at night.

Had I left Apache at 4-5am I would have made Payson last year in my estimation and my overall pace was slow. Kurt probably killed this section and would nearly make Pine with a 4-5am Apache departure.

edit- Marshal, Punkin Center water is just a fast ride from Roosevelt and there is a spigot on the east side of the general store/gas station that I used after hours. Dont worry about the Cholla CG idea I did think that I needed water there too and made it easily with water to spare.

[AZTtripper]

I'll be working on the water list for that section next. But like Mark said it's pretty fast. There is water  and a resort and CG at Canyon Lake off course. Also there is water and showers at La Cholla CG.

There can be a lot of traffic on the beginning paved part of Apache Trail but there's really nothing past Tortilla Flat.  

Here's the water list from the end of the 300 to Pine.

#28.   Town of Superior (Cstore, restaurants, motel)      5 miles off course highway or LOST trail
#29.   Apache Jct (fast food on course everything else including bike shop off course)
#30.   Tortilla Flat (restaurant, water) (water at CG across road)   17 miles from AJ
#31   Burnt Corral CG (water spigot)             19 miles form Tortilla Flat      
#32   Cholla CG (water, showers, fee campground)      10.5 from Burnt Corral
#33.   Punkin Center (Cstore spigot after hours, restaurant)     13 miles from Cholla CG
#34   Jakes Corner (Cstore, Bar and Grill)            10 miles from Punkin Center
#35   Rye (restaurant)                  8.5 from Jakes   
#36   Payson (everything including Bike shop closed Sundays)   on course
#37   Pine (Cstore, restaurants, cabins) off course there is a 2 track to stay off highway.   22  miles from Payson

I can't remember what all was on course at AJ I remember the fast food. Mark do you know was there a Cstore there also. Seems like there was a big motel there as well.

After Pine it's the AZT all the way. I'll be reworking the water table from a bike stand point as well but for now.
http://www.fredgaudetphotography.com/aztrail/watercurrent.pdf

[dream4est]

Tim- Heading into AJ has lots of stuff all over on the highway- c-store with mickey-d's on right, a hotel I believe on the left and then a big chain grocery store on the right in a shopping center. As you head west on Apache Trail towards the bike shop (slightly off route but flat and fast, go left on Apache Trail, not right as Mountain View Drive hits Apache Trail) it is commercial everything for miles heading into metro Phoenix. The bike shop is 5-6 miles west of Apache Trail and Mtn. View and had 29" tires, Slime pro tubeless and parts:

Junction Bicycle Sales & Service
10839 E Apache Trl # 131
Apache Junction, AZ 85120-3499
(480) 380-0811
junctionbike.com‎


The next bike shop is in Payson, 2 blocks east off route at main intersection of town:

Hike, Bike, & Run
600 East Highway 260 Suite #3
Payson, AZ 85541
(928) 478-6918
hikebikeandrun.com‎

The owner rides 29ers and sold me a tire right off his personal bike. He also held Matt F. and Brad K.'s bike and box/shipped them home for them. He even let me leave my bike in the shop while I shopped at the grocery store across the street.

[Marshal]

ahhh, I hope I do not need to use any bike shop addresses

[dream4est]

I am planning to use the bike shop in Payson for a drivetrain cleaning, stans shot, etc. while I shop at the grocery store. But hopefully no new tires this year. I actually ran over a deck screw in Payson and had it jammed in my tire but holding air. The cholla I survived OK but 2.5" screws are my nemesis!

[AZTtripper]

Thanks Mark good info for sure.

Sounds like there are stores right on route and then everything else less the 6 easy miles west of the course. Assuming you mean heading west where the route turns north or did you go north and then back southwest. Sounds more like you stayed on course and made the connection from hwy 60 to hwy 88 aka Apache Trail and then headed SW on AT into town.

Not sure where Scott is on urban routes. We had talked about not requiring riders to take the short cut through towns if they needed services and then letting riders rejoin the course on the way out.

Obviously those not needing services make better time by going the short route but if you are heading farther in it makes no sense to retrace back on course. In the case of AJ the course and the two highways make a huge triangle. We'll have to see what Scott thinks about people just staying on hwy 60 into town services and then hit AT right at the junction. Also any opinion from you guys on this metro clause?

[pro_out]

''The owner rides 29ers and sold me a tire right off his personal bike. He also held Matt F. and Brad K.'s bike and box/shipped them home for them. He even let me leave my bike in the shop while I shopped at the grocery store across the street.''

 Mick is one of the nice guy. If your ever at his shop and have time to chat, ask him about his adventures. He's had some of his on.

[dream4est]

I do not really see much of an issue in AJ- as it is flat and fast. The extra 2 or 3 miles I went around the triangle were over in minutes. You do not need to go off route for the grocery store I mentioned above- it is right at Mtn. view and Superstition Hwy. I only went off route to get to the bike shop as my bike was worked over from the crazy blizzard start of the 750 at the border. I literally had McGuyver's bike- no spare tubes no spare brake pads and a failing tire. I had a plastic brake pad up front I fashioned trailside past Oracle.

You could have some type of rule where in town action is whatever route through town you want (like in Payson or Flag or Tasayan) but I think staying with the current rules work too. The moves off route are pretty easy and relatively short.

[Marshal]

Not sure where Scott is on urban routes. We had talked about not requiring riders to take the short cut through towns if they needed services and then letting riders rejoin the course on the way out.

Obviously those not needing services make better time by going the short route but if you are heading farther in it makes no sense to retrace back on course. In the case of AJ the course and the two highways make a huge triangle. We'll have to see what Scott thinks about people just staying on hwy 60 into town services and then hit AT right at the junction. Also any opinion from you guys on this metro clause?

I hesitate to weigh in with rule comments any more but a simple “rejoin the route where you left it” is the cleanest way to do it. 

[dream4est]

 Mick is one of the nice guy. If your ever at his shop and have time to chat, ask him about his adventures. He's had some of his on.

Yes he is very cool. So was the guy at Junction bikes in Apache Junction (I think his name is Joel?). I met some really nice people in the race and in Arizona in general.
A beef jerky rancher guy near Hayden? had a 29" tube for me when I bailed near Antelope Peak. It was like someone just wanted me to finish. The guy didnt even own a 29er- just had a 29" presta tube in his barn by accident! And it was the last commercial option I had in that area and by total luck as I was heading back to the course dejected with no tubes left and a failing tire.  Best $5 I have ever spent. Good people out there.