2011 CTR Planning

[jakomait]

Just remember to honor the slow guys too if you're out on the course. In last year's race, spectators handed out goodies to CTR racers--but only to the fast guys. It was rather demoralizing to miss the cupcake stand. And it really sucked to come across the pile of trash that at one time held cool drinks enjoyed by the faster riders!

Personally, I think that ALL "trail magic" should be banned, aside from Apple (who has snacks for EVERYONE)!

I cant speak for anyone else but I probably qualify as a 'fast guy' and no goodies were ever handed out to me during my adventure last year.  I didnt even see the infamous Apple either cause I went through that area in the night with the Boogie man haunting me.  That area was creepy and I was seriously scared!  The only trail magic I had were the views, especially riding as the sun comes up!

[jeffkerkove]

In last year's race, spectators handed out goodies to CTR racers--but only to the fast guys. It was rather demoralizing to miss the cupcake stand. And it really sucked to come across the pile of trash that at one time held cool drinks enjoyed by the faster riders!  Personally, I think that ALL "trail magic" should be banned, aside from Apple (who has snacks for EVERYONE)!

People were handing out 'goodies' last year to the leaders?  I must have missed this. Only 'Trail Angel' I came across last year was right at the end of Section 17 right before crossing Hwy 114.  This was a 10x10 tent man'd by the President of the Colorado Trail Foundation and his 2 man crew.  He was there for the week to support anyone passing thru.

[Done]

Whatever, I guess the cupcakes weren't being handed out to the leaders. But those who got cupcakes and cold drinks and goodies from the Styrofoam coolers know what I'm talking about (and, yes, they were faster than I was!). And maybe it's no big deal for everyone, but I thought it sucked that people were meeting riders along the way and providing goodies to some, but not to everyone--which is my only point.

[timroz]

Paranoid?  It seems odd to assume that because you saw some trash it was because somebody was handing out food to CTR racers.

[Done]

Paranoid?  It seems odd to assume that because you saw some trash it was because somebody was handing out food to CTR racers.

No, Tim, it's not paranoia. I was there, as were others. You were not, so I think it's a bit of a reach for you to assume that I'm being paranoid. Kind of insulting to call someone paranoid, when you don't have the facts, eh?

Hell, there was a sign-in sheet at the coolers! Lots of riders signed in, and thanked the guys who dropped it for CTR racers. By the time I got there, the coolers had been smashed up (an animal, perhaps?), and all the remained were chunks of foam, the sign-in sheets, and some plastic bags.

On the top of Kenosha Pass, there were a couple of people who drove up there just to hand out cupcakes to riders. I just missed them, or so several other riders told me.

There was at least one other spot with a cooler, but I missed it. I don't know if had been cleaned up by the time I got there, or if I simply didn't see it.

But forget this whole exchange if you like. If people really don't have a problem with "selective trail magic," then have at it. Just because it seems unfair and contrary to the idea of the race to me, doesn't mean that much, right?

Edit: here's the relevant FAQ from the CTR website:

Q: What about this "Trail Magic" I keep hearing about?
A: Beautiful, beautiful trail magic. Totally unexpected and unplanned support. e.g. a random person giving you a coke or an orange. Or finding a box of girl scout cookies on the side of the road. But let's keep the magic, magic - if you personally know the person who is offering unplanned/unexpected support, politely decline their offer. And please, no begging!

I'm just putting this out there in hopes that people THINK before choosing to leave goodies for their buddies. If you don't care about this rule and/or the intentions behind it, then obviously you are free to think whatever you like of me--including writing me off as a delusional and paranoid crank!

Enjoy the race!

[saferider]

I too saw the magicless coolers and trash...

[Done]

What's the road like from Sedalia to the start?  At night.  On a bike.  Probably after a few beers.

I was just up there a couple of weeks ago. The short answer: not my cup of tea. There's no way that I'd ride it.

The longer answer: the road is very narrow and twisty for about ten miles, with no shoulder at all. Lots of trucks pulling trailers. I think that it would be the most dangerous part of the entire CTR!

[Zach]

Thanks for the glove advice - warm gloves packed!
Next questions:
Am I right in thinking there are no resupply options between Hot Springs and Silverton.
In case of mechanical problems, bike shops in Breckenridge, Leadville, Buena Vista and Silverton?

There also aren't any good resupply options between Bailey and Copper.  If I hadn't found a box full of 40 cupcakes last year on Kenosha Pass, I would have bonked so hard.  They were delicious though.  All of them.

[timroz]

I was just up there a couple of weeks ago. The short answer: not my cup of tea. There's no way that I'd ride it.

The longer answer: the road is very narrow and twisty for about ten miles, with no shoulder at all. Lots of trucks pulling trailers. I think that it would be the most dangerous part of the entire CTR!

Thanks for the input on the road Toby.  I'll stay off of it.  I disliked 285 in the day.  No way I'd do it in the dark.  This one sounds worse.

Just messing with you on the paraniod comment.  I saw some "interesting" stuff also.  I just figure it's none of my business.  I'm not out there to enforce rules on other people, nor do I care if they follow them.
 

[Done]

Thanks for the input on the road Toby.  I'll stay off of it.  I disliked 285 in the day.  No way I'd do it in the dark.  This one sounds worse.

Less traffic, but way narrower. If you're having trouble getting to the trailhead from Sedalia, I bet that you could stick your thumb out in the morning and get a ride from another CTR rider. I'd offer you a ride myself, but I'll have my family with me, and therefore no empty seats--sorry.

I'm not out there to enforce rules on other people, nor do I care if they follow them.

I have mixed feelings on this one. On one hand, I think that it's important for the race to enforce it's own rules, rather than depend on an organizer to do it for us--which means that racers need to call each other out when corners are cut. After all, we are joining an EVENT, which is different from a solo ride. The integrity of a race is absolutely dependent on people following the same rules and ethics--and it pisses me off when people don't respect the intentions of the visionaries who got the ball rolling. Along those lines, I think that it was appropriate for several riders to come forward with information that disqualified a guy who broke a whole heap of rules last year; he simply didn't deserve to be listed as a finisher along with guys who put their hearts and souls into this amazing race.

On the other hand, I hate dealing with rules and cheaters. So a big part of me wants to just go out and do my own thing--especially when people give me crap.

But the truth is that I enjoy being out there with other good folks, "competing" in an event that we all share and love. So, I fall on the side of believing that we owe it to each other to understand and sort out the rules. That means asking tough questions, thinking about what's fair, and calling out people who flunk the honor code. Without Stefan's rules putting us on a level playing field, and our collective efforts to uphold them, the CTR wouldn't be a race!

[timroz]

Yeah - I can tell you care a lot more about a lot of things than I do.  And by no means am I saying that in a bad way.

I just think that anyone that cheats in this type of race (no one watching to actually SEE if you cheat) is a loser and not worth my time to worry about.  I don't understand why people care so much.  But that's probably more about me than you.

[DanHickstein]

On the top of Kenosha Pass, there were a couple of people who drove up there just to hand out cupcakes to riders.

I too would like to see an improvement in the quality of these "trail angels".

Firstly, why cupcakes? Why have these hipsters made them so popular in the first place? It seems like there are cupcake shops everywhere these days. I'd take good muffin over a cupcake any day. Pumpkin walnut, lemon poppyseed, or just plain-old blueberry all beat any cupcake hands down.

Secondly: cupcakes at Kenosha Pass? As I understand it, Hostess Cupcakes are about the best food that a hungry CTR rider can acquire riding through Bailey at odd hours of the night. I expect to be about 10 hostess cupcakes in when I finally make it up the hill to the pass. I'll be ready for some real food. How about bacon at Kenosha Pass? Or at least an espresso bar.   

Yours truly,
Dan

[Done]

I too would like to see an improvement in the quality of these "trail angels".

Dan, I appreciate your effort to introduce some humor into this exchange. Thanks.

I'm not trying to be a jerk by pointing out that it's contrary to the rules and ethics of the CTR to set up aid stations on the course. And, yes, cupcakes and coolers full of goodies are aid--and I think that they erode the quality of the race. Further, it's demoralizing as hell to come across trash on the trail, left by people who offered "trail magic" to only a select few riders.

Tim, I'm glad that cheaters don't bother you. Honestly, I wish that they didn't bother me. But I can't help it--when I see a loser attempting to elevate himself to the same level as those who play fair, I get pissed. This of true of whether I'm participating in the event or not!

[TruthRider]

I am driving from MN to CO to be a spectator for this race...I CAN'T WAIT!!!!
Go CTR riders go!!

I love this!!  @timroz, hope you were joking with the " ... just plain weird" line.  I'm probably biased because this spectator happens to be my sister coming out to check out the race and my first attempt. 

It is an interesting debate about trail magic.  Toby brings a good point - that unless someone stays in one spot for up to two weeks to offer snacks to everyone, then by definition they are giving preferential treatment to some.

I certainly plan to accept nothing from my awesome sister, who may just be the farthest traveled spectator this year.  Given Toby's point I will probably *hope* to not accept anything from anyone, the Trail Angel probably excepting, but I also know that may change if I come on something/someone when I'm having a bad time and need a pick me up.  Which might describe the Hwy 50-to-Durango section.

I've greatly enjoyed the forum these past few months - thanks to everyone.  Awesome community.  Look forward to meeting some of you on Monday and throughout the state.  This event is probably the coolest thing I've come across in 25 years of mtn biking.

[timroz]

I love this!!  @timroz, hope you were joking with the " ... just plain weird" line.  I'm probably biased because this spectator happens to be my sister coming out

That's different for sure.  Random people driving 24 hours to watch strangers go by on a bike is weird.  I'll be less judgemental in my next life...

So now I suppose someone will start the "moral support" argument?

[Done]

Tim, I think it's amusing that you seem quicker to flog someone for driving out to watch a race than you are to call someone out for cheating! Spectators seems relatively harmless as long as they "look but doesn't touch," while letting someone cheat seems to undermine the very integrity of the event.

FYI, the CTR doesn't prohibit "moral support," so you're good to go there.

[DaveH]

FYI, the CTR doesn't prohibit "moral support," so you're good to go there.

Hmmm.  Pacers are explicitly prohibited (a form of moral support), and following that sentence is an "etc."  Physical moral support is against the TD rules, just for reference.  Hate to say it, but I'd put having a family member meet/cheer you on course squarely in the gray area. 

That said, I hope nobody ever takes this issue to this level of seriousness.  Riding your bike across the rooftop of Colorado is badass, and if you can share a tiny piece with a non-racing family member how could that possibly be a bad thing?

[DaveH]

letting someone cheat seems to undermine the very integrity of the event.

Only the integrity of the rider.  Events don't have any to start

[Done]

Only the integrity of the rider.  Events don't have any to start

Dave, I have no idea what your point is...

[DaveH]

Dave, I have no idea what your point is...

Events don't have integrity, people do.