2018 AZTR300/750 Planning Thread

[flyboy]

Hey all, the new kid on the block back in 2017 FINALLY finished his trip report.  It's long as hell, has lots of pictures, and can be found here:

https://bdbsoutdooradventures.wordpress.com/2018/02/12/my-2017-arizona-trail-race/

Maybe it'll help get some of you lucky saps doing it in 2018, more stoked up.  Yeah, yeah, that's the ticket:  I held off finishing my trip report so it'd be ready just before this year's event.

I really hope is that Rhino's grandma doesn't read it, track me down, and throat punch me in disgust.

Wow! That took me 2 days to get through! Almost glad you didn’t get to Stateline as I have to go to work!   (kidding)
Thanks for the detail though. It all helps with a rookie’s planning.

[schillingsworth]

Can we talk tires for a hot minute?  I've been rocking Maxxis Ardents (29x2.4) as of late, and am a fan.  Only one puncture, they hook up good, perform pretty well in the soggy PNW winter and were great in the super loose summer gravel.  However, I need new tires for this year's full fun and am curious if some vets and/or locals want to steer me away from the Ardent and to something else.  I've been happy with Maxxis in general - was sponsored by them a long time ago when I raced collegiate.  Now I rock them on almost everything I ride, MTB, gravel, commuter.  I won't be in the front pack, so super fast/light isn't my jam.  I just want a great performer for the Arizona conditions that I'm not familiar with riding.  Also, I'm riding rigid if that makes a difference in any comments.  Thanks!

Ardents are a great choice for the AZT. EXO 3C blah, blah. Bontrager XR3/4 Team's are solid as well. Personally, I've had too many issues with Ikon's to trust them any longer. No thanks. I know that goes against the grain for a few riders, best of luck to you all!! I've also had really good results with Specialized Ground Control GRIDs. It really boils down to the robustness of the sidewalls, I'm still in amazement when someone shows up here with super light, paper thin sidewall race tires. They tend to find out real quick how bad an idea that was.

[Adam Alphabet]

I used Aggressors last year 29 x 2.3" and will use them again this year.
I've had too many failures with Ikons to trust them. Up here Ardents are one the the worst tires you can use, people seem to like them down in the dryer areas.

At the end of the day anything AZT related just keep this mantra... "WWJSD?"  What Would John Schilling Do? and just go with that, you'll probably be fine.

[Jeff Z]

Youre technically not "allowed" to ride 67 while it's closed to the public now. I'm going to play dumb and ride it anyway.

When Rhino and I got our permits at the south rim the ranger dutifully informed us we couldn't take the road. We told her we'd just take the trail. That was what she wanted to hear.

Of course the north rim was absolutely buried under snow, so we ended up on the road - along with a couple of hikers. My Spot malfunctioned while I was riding in the park. Saw one pickup - who paid me no mind. ymmv.

I am very curious as to the logic of closing the road to bikes. Maybe it is an insurance thing? Bikers are likely to fall off their bikes? While hikers are just fine. Not that these sorts of rules have any kind of logic, but I'd love to hear the reasoning.

[ScottM]

I am very curious as to the logic of closing the road to bikes. Maybe it is an insurance thing? Bikers are likely to fall off their bikes? While hikers are just fine. Not that these sorts of rules have any kind of logic, but I'd love to hear the reasoning.

I'd love to hear the logic, too.  The only thing I have heard is safety -- that there are vehicles on the road and maybe snow plows, not looking for traffic/bikes.  A pedestrian is only marginally safer, so you are right, it makes no sense.

[gesose]

"WWJSD?"  What Would John Schilling Do? and just go with that, you'll probably be fine.

That's just about gospel around these parts huh?

It really boils down to the robustness of the sidewalls

This is sound advice.  Thanks John.

Thanks everyone for chiming in re: tires.  I think I'll stick with the Ardents that I know - they will at least be predictable. 

[rhino]

Can we talk tires for a hot minute?  I've been rocking Maxxis Ardents (29x2.4) as of late, and am a fan.  Only one puncture, they hook up good, perform pretty well in the soggy PNW winter and were great in the super loose summer gravel.  However, I need new tires for this year's full fun and am curious if some vets and/or locals want to steer me away from the Ardent and to something else.  I've been happy with Maxxis in general - was sponsored by them a long time ago when I raced collegiate.  Now I rock them on almost everything I ride, MTB, gravel, commuter.  I won't be in the front pack, so super fast/light isn't my jam.  I just want a great performer for the Arizona conditions that I'm not familiar with riding.  Also, I'm riding rigid if that makes a difference in any comments.  Thanks!

I use almost exclusively in Arizona, Maxxis Ardent 29x2.4 EXO walls on rigid SS.
My only advice it stay away from the Maxxis gumwalls.  They are hot tits on a titanium bike, but the gumwall sidewalls just do not patch the same as the standard black sidewalls. I've had troubles getting patches to permanently stick to the outside of the gumwall tire, and also had trouble getting a stitched sidewall to completely seal with the gumwalls.  I've had ZERO issues with my Maxxis Ardents in black wall.

[Dinodinodino]

Fear of the unknown.  Living in Western Canada I do a fair amount of camping in bear country. I am familiar with what to do around bears and they are fairly predictable so I am never worried them.  I can sleep in my bear-burrito bivy like a baby.

Since I have rarely camped in the desert, I am a bit worried about the creepy crawlies and things that slither.  Should I be worried about creatures crawling on my face while I sleep in my bivy?  Do snakes snuggle up to you while sleeping?  I haven't seen any talk about this kind of thing on the forum especially compared to the bear talk on the Tour Divide forum so it makes me think my fears are unfounded. 

Can any experienced desert campers help set my mind at ease?  Thanks in advance!

https://andersonsoutside.blogspot.ca/

[mvmorten]

Fear of the unknown. 

Can any experienced desert campers help set my mind at ease?  Thanks in advance!

I've lived and camped in the desert my entire life and never had a problem with creatures of any kind.

[Jeff Z]

Fear of the unknown.  Living in Western Canada I do a fair amount of camping in bear country. I am familiar with what to do around bears and they are fairly predictable so I am never worried them.  I can sleep in my bear-burrito bivy like a baby.

Since I have rarely camped in the desert, I am a bit worried about the creepy crawlies and things that slither.  Should I be worried about creatures crawling on my face while I sleep in my bivy?  Do snakes snuggle up to you while sleeping?  I haven't seen any talk about this kind of thing on the forum especially compared to the bear talk on the Tour Divide forum so it makes me think my fears are unfounded. 

Can any experienced desert campers help set my mind at ease?  Thanks in advance!

https://andersonsoutside.blogspot.ca/

I had a similar concern about snakes, scorpions, etc when I first started sleeping in the desert. But in nearly 10 years here, have not had that happen and haven't heard of anyone else experiencing it. Now, if you leave food in your bivy - you are asking for trouble.

[phatmike]

The only thing that has ever bothered me was a skunk - I had food in my pack on the ground close to my sleeping location. My fault for being to lazy after finishing up the Molino HAB and subsequent descent into the campground there at about 1AM to properly store my food away.

[rhino]

Fear of the unknown...

No issues personally with critters.  Your biggest concern to critters will be food and sweat (salt).

I don't leave any wrappers, trash, food, or salty clothing laying around at night.  I tie everything down at night to the bike or pack it away (shoes, gloves, helmets)so the critter don't carry them off to chew on all night long  <I've never had issues with critters...thanks to advice from veterans - Tim and Max!

[CSMITH]

Seeing as how riders are limited, any of the more leisure riders ( like myself ) thought about starting the day before and keeping race day for the "racers"?  Like a group ITT.. if that's a thing.  Just an idea I've been kicking around my head. 

[CSMITH]

Landsharkbrian, great read by the way.  I was one of the guys near the gargantuan van haha.  I can assure you I wasn't passed out, more frozen solid.  That was a coooold night.

[bmattingly]

Dino,

I have seen 3 rattlesnakes during the day in the stretch between Mtn Lemon North side to the Gila River.  And another during the day west of Colossal Cave a few miles.  Rattle warnings are great.  I've encountered none at night.  The desert can get quite cold and snakes get way lethargic in cold at night.  While in my bag the only exposed area is my face.  The above suggestions about securing food at night is wise.  I had 4 or 5 javelina come into my camp the last night of the 750.  They have a keen sense of smell and poor sight.  They smelled some nuts I was eating.  One suggestion is sometimes there is an option to camp near another rider.  I've had many nights out solo in Arizona and most have been pleasant.  Most critters don't want anything to do with us either.  I have more fear for bears than the AZ snakes and scorpions.

Good luck!

[aarond]

A good chance of encountering rattlesnakes, so keep your eyes open, you can't always rely on a rattle:  https://www.abc15.com/news/region-phoenix-metro/central-phoenix/rattlesnakes-evolving-losing-their-rattles-expert-says

[Adam Alphabet]

Fear of the unknown.  Living in Western Canada I do a fair amount of camping in bear country. I am familiar with what to do around bears and they are fairly predictable so I am never worried them.  I can sleep in my bear-burrito bivy like a baby.

Since I have rarely camped in the desert, I am a bit worried about the creepy crawlies and things that slither.  Should I be worried about creatures crawling on my face while I sleep in my bivy?  Do snakes snuggle up to you while sleeping?  I haven't seen any talk about this kind of thing on the forum especially compared to the bear talk on the Tour Divide forum so it makes me think my fears are unfounded. 

Can any experienced desert campers help set my mind at ease?  Thanks in advance!

https://andersonsoutside.blogspot.ca/

Hey Dino, fellow Western Canadian with some desert experience under my belt now.
Some good chat in here from a few years ago. I had a very similar concern....
http://www.bikepacking.net/forum/question-and-answer/azt-300-sleeping-setup/

I now love the desert and try to get back any chance I get. You'll be fine. My first year doing the 300 I saw a rattler going down to Beehive and a gila monster near Bellota before the Molino hike a bike. Both were highlights of the trip for me. Especially the gila as they're apparently quite rare to see.
Lots of good tips above. As you would up here, use your sense, trust your instinct and don't stick your hands in strange holes!
Good Luck!

[Dinodinodino]

Fear of the unknown. 

https://andersonsoutside.blogspot.ca/

Thanks so much for the reassurance everyone!  It sounds like if you practice good back country habits like securing your food and leaving no trace (as everyone should) there is not much to worry about. 

"Don't stick your hands in strange holes" are wise words to remember in every aspect of your life.   Ha!

[Mtnrunner43]

I'd love to hear the logic, too.  The only thing I have heard is safety -- that there are vehicles on the road and maybe snow plows, not looking for traffic/bikes.  A pedestrian is only marginally safer, so you are right, it makes no sense.

It sounds to me like we (worst case scenario) could also just leave the bikes packed and continue on hiking on the road for 9+ miles to the National Park gate and then take the road from there to Jacob Lake? Is that how all the hikers and skiers get in to the North rim?

[Ron Thomson]

Kaibab Plateau Trail,
Here are some pics I took in 2014. Snow was light that year, hoping for similar conditions this year.

Fingers crossed this link works:
https://photos.app.goo.gl/zwwjPqKWKSs3LJEQ2