2016 Arizona Trail Race AZTR planning thread

[bncrshr77]

From what i can tell there is no set date for palisades... Last year they turned it on right before the race... Sure hope its on this year!

[ScottM]

As far as I can remember, the spigot has always been on during the AZTR.  But bncrshr is right, there's no set date that I've ever heard of.  It's turned on just before the AZTR a few times.

The way this winter is shaping up, it might be back on next week....

[ScottM]

Just a quick program note: I updated the site with the 300's new start time: 8am.

750 will remain at 7am.

[Flagster]

As far as I can remember, the spigot has always been on during the AZTR.  But bncrshr is right, there's no set date that I've ever heard of.  It's turned on just before the AZTR a few times.

The way this winter is shaping up, it might be back on next week....

Thanks
You are right about winter.  After two weeks of 60 degrees up here in N. AZ I am not as worried about the North Rim...the snow is all but gone under 8000 ft...but March is supposed to be a wet month

[Adam Alphabet]

What do the early warm temps now potentially mean for mid April/race time? and for those of us who are still riding in temps in the wet 40's!?

[MikeI]

What do the early warm temps now potentially mean for mid April/race time? and for those of us who are still riding in temps in the wet 40's!?

Very hard to say ... but I can tell you that it was hot in Ripsey on Saturday afternoon, and the snakes are up and out ... they were in abundance at 24HOP, and I got really close to one on Sat ( thought it was a cow flop ) ...  the earliest 100 deg day in Tucson is April 19  ... it's supposed to be wetter in March according to some El Nino forecasts. I would guess low 90's would be probable for the desert sections.

[Adam Alphabet]

Very hard to say ... but I can tell you that it was hot in Ripsey on Saturday afternoon, and the snakes are up and out ... they were in abundance at 24HOP, and I got really close to one on Sat ( thought it was a cow flop ) ...  the earliest 100 deg day in Tucson is April 19  ... it's supposed to be wetter in March according to some El Nino forecasts. I would guess low 90's would be probable for the desert sections.

Thanks Mike. I guess we'll just have to wait and see. Just wish I could prep for it somehow!

[ScottM]

Just wanted to bring the following thread to the attention of 750ers and AZT fanatics in general:

http://www.bikepacking.net/forum/bikepacking/possible-changes-to-bike-access-in-grand-canyon-backcountry-plan-comments-need/

The extended day hike permit system is in some ways badly needed in the park (for safety), but it limits things, especially for 750 racers -- everyone hiking across the canyon will have to make a visit to the permit office, even if you aren't camping.  It's unclear what will happen if all the permits are gone and you are on a thru-trip.  The new plan does call for special consideration for AZT thru-hikers for camping, so perhaps that consideration would be included in extended day hike permits as well.  I will likely include a plea for that special consideration in my comments (I don't think they are going to be dissuaded of the idea of permits in general).

Anyway, give it a read and drop a comment if you've got the time.

Service note: the Desert Spoon cafe that is marked by a fork/knife symbol in Colossal Cave is permanently closed.  I've suggested they remove the sign.  It's been a favorite spot to grab an ice cream sandwich and maybe a burrito on tours or day rides in the past.  It's not too much of an issue for people racing as a lot of folks roll through during the dark, anyway.  But just in case anyone had their hearts set on it.

It's replaced by a new cafe that is quite tasty, but it's all the way up at the cave entrance, which is a hefty climb off route.  The pizza is good if you do make the climb.

[woodsy]

I'm curious what type of mechanical issues have past 750 finishers, or not, encountered along the route. I'm definitely interested in getting into this, however I haven't done a long race like this before and am unsure of the toll it would take on my bike.

[SlowRide]

I'm curious what type of mechanical issues have past 750 finishers, or not, encountered along the route. I'm definitely interested in getting into this, however I haven't done a long race like this before and am unsure of the toll it would take on my bike.

Last year on the first day a big stick jumped up in my spokes passing by the tank on Canello Road, it ripped my spoke out at the thread. Didn't want to compromise my tubeless setup so I left it as it was and rode on it. Also had a leaking front brake that started on day one that got progressively worse each day until I had really no front brake. Hobbled it in to Tucson on those two mechanicals and got fixed up. No more mechanicals for the rest of my 750.

[Yogi the Barry]

From a lowly 300's perspective in 2014...
Only ~6 miles into the start, I ripped a rear tire knob partially off, which caused weepage/sealing cycles of stress for my entire 300. Third day put a second cut into the rear tread, which sealed as long as I didn't pump the tire more than about 22 psi. This was a big pisser for me because I consider myself to ride very rim and tire friendly. Two take aways from my tire experiment - 1) SnakeSkin Schwalbe's might have a tough sidewall, and they relatively do, but tread is too vulnerable for AZ terrain. 2) I now ride with lower pressure than I did pre-AZT. Depending on what version 2.25-2.4 tire mounted up, I now run about 22-25 front and 24-28 rear. No more.
Witnessed four other mechanicals on other bikes. 1) Missing/snapped chainring bolts first morning. 2) Fork losing most [all?] inflation on first day. 3) Nipple snapped flush with rim in Sonoita. 4) Rider with one good tubeless tire and the other tire a failed tube setup who had to borrow a patch from me. This person eventually had to bail and walk out with a flatted tire, due to running out of tubes, sealant and patches. Think I remember the comment of something like "there wasn't enough time for me to make both tires work tubeless."

I'm curious what type of mechanical issues have past 750 finishers, or not, encountered along the route. I'm definitely interested in getting into this, however I haven't done a long race like this before and am unsure of the toll it would take on my bike.

[LandSharkBrian]

Hi all,

I'm new to this madness, looking forward to AZTR 300 this year.  If I post this incorrectly, my apologies.

Guessing several have seen it, but the Lael attempt is posted.  I'm in complete awe of that Grand Canyon crossing.
http://www.rei.com/h/trails?cm_mmc=email_com_gm-_-trials_2_mtb_hero-_-022316-_-img_hero&ev36=25089108&RMID=20160223_GM_Trails_2_MTB_Hero_SL1&RRID=59746184&ev11=0

BTW if any northerners have proven methods for getting in high quality training during the cold dark months, I'm all ears.  For me here in Michigan it's been a combination of taking the rig out on the road, weights, XC skiing, a bit of swimming, and a kickass weekend down in Lajitas, TX for 22.5 hours of riding, gear test, and rediscovering beer.  Hoping the mild weather here holds up a bit longer and I can get out and ride the trails soon...

[davew]

SnakeSkin Schwalbe's might have a tough sidewall, and they relatively do, but tread is too vulnerable for AZ terrain.

+1

Last year I rode Schwable Hans Damph for the volume. An absolute joy in the washes and on the trail but by 250miles they were about ready to throw out. The knobs on the side were all but torn away or worn to less than half. The main tread pattern was looking pretty pathetic and I had serous doubts they would make the State Line. As it turns out medical conditions were weaker than these tyres so I did not get to see how far I could ride them (not much past Phoenix I suspect). I expected them to be slow on the sealed roads and was not disappointed.

[Flagster]

maxxis ardent

[SlowRide]

I ran Maxxis Ardent EXO TR front and rear for AZTR750 last year and after running a Maxxis IKON 2.35 EXO TR rear in the CTR I'd go back to AZTR with IKON 2.35 rear and Ardent front. For TDR, AZTR, and CTR the Maxxis compounds really did well. Ran IKON 2.2's on the Divide.

[Yogi the Barry]

Re: Schwalbe - If somebody gave me a 2.35 SnakeSkin Nobby Nic for free, I might run it on the front. Every Schwalbe tire I've ever owned is a marriage gone bad. Great traction and then they either get cut or all the knobs partially tear or totally get ripped off.
[Edit: In case I'm locally spotted running the Schwalbe RaRa and seem to be full of BS, It's because my Ripley LS just shipped with two of them, I'm cheap and I'm trying to wear them out as training tires, but my fingers are crossed.]
Re: Maxxis - I second the Ardent. At least the EXO version. It's my current tire of choice. And since both the 2.25 and 2.4 have almost identical weights, I like the higher volume 2.4. Nice cush on the rear of a hardtail and aggro enough for me mounted up front.

Second choice for a rear tire is Saguaro TNT, but bead on the two I tried was too tight for Stan's rims and are mounted on training wheels.
Neil likes Ikon EXO ...
http://bikepackersmagazine.com/maxxis-ikon-tires/
I might try an Ikon on the rear, but seems I've knee jerked away from lighter tires after negative experiences. Besides, after you wear away ~50 grams of Ardent, aren't you about left with an Ikon or an Ardent Race?
But with all things rubber, YMMV.
-Barry

maxxis ardent

[Gimmearaise]

Just noticed on Google maps that the Safeway in Tucson off of Broadway rd is listed as 'permanently closed'. There appears to be an Albertson's about a mile farther west on Broadway rd. Any locals care to confirm?

How the heck does that happen??? Well, that is more of a reason to bypass Tucson. The past two times I rode the 300, I went on Broadway, and I really don't want to do that again.

[AZTtripper]

How the heck does that happen??? Well, that is more of a reason to bypass Tucson. The past two times I rode the 300, I went on Broadway, and I really don't want to do that again.

And now Fry's wants to build a super center just a mile down Houghton. The city is reneging on promised buffer space to allow it. The city council is always taking heat for being anti business and killing jobs by being anti growth. So I guess they are making some friends somewhere with this one.

The Circle K on Reddington is likely a more efficient stop.

[Gimmearaise]

So I have heard what Rick Miller did with the Mountain Smith Strapettes. http://www.rei.com/product/671335/mountainsmith-strapettes

What have others used in the past for the ditch hike? Sounds like something with a framed back is nice to give you a bit more structure. I have a Osprey Talon, but its an old one without a framed back. I'm not apposed to rocking a backpack for the entire race, but I really hate weight on my back. What packs have others used?

[Guild44]

Hi there! I've decided to do the 750 a little late in the game. I've done TDR (2015 - Sarah Jansen) and the Colorado Trail (solo tour from Denver to Silverton, summer 2014), but something tells me this will be the hardest of the three, at least for me ... . !! As a Tucson native, though, I'm super excited. :-) Arizona riding has always been my favorite.

Anyway, just saying "hello"! And also, I have a few questions ...

I'm using the Arizona Trail Association as my main planning resource. So, I'm reviewing the Guidebook (put it on my iPhone, too) and the Data Book (also on the iPhone). I do well with just following GPS tracks (I take multiple GPS units), so the plan would be to know the food and water stops but, otherwise, to rely mainly on my Garmin units. This worked well for TDR, but is this a good way of going for AZTR? I imagine it's easier to miss turnoffs on the Arizona Trail ... . I'm wondering whether I should do the whole cue sheet thing ... .

I'm going to finally make the leap and try a minimalist structure, instead of a tent. I thought I heard somewhere about a dual sleeping-bag bivvy setup. ?? It actually looks like a lot of people do an emergency bivvy and a sleeping bag. I found I didn't really need an air mattress on the Divide, so I'm thinking of scratching that, too.

It sounds like a spare tire is a good idea. Yes or no? Or just go with super beefy tires, like the Ardent? Having had a tire completely blow up on me on the TDR, it seems it might be wise to have a spare tire ... .

Do you take a lot of rain gear? Rain pants? Rain gloves?

Carbon bars? I took them on the TDR, but I worried the entire time.

Has anybody tried taking wool dress tights, instead of cycling tights? I've tried them some on day rides, and they keep me warm and are way lighter/less voluminous than cycling tights. I'm wondering how they'll hold up, though ...

For those who hike in their bike shoes through the Grand Canyon, what shoes do you use? I'm hoping to buy a good pair I can both bike (clipped in) and hike in ... .

Any answers to any of these questions would be hugely appreciated! Thanks, and see you out there!