Bike bags and carbon frames.

[todd551k]

What do people do to prevent severe abrasion to their carbon frames when racing with bike bags? Thanks for any thoughts.

[12wheels]

Cover the spots you're worried about with helicopter tape.  You can buy it on Amazon, Ebay, or from most auto parts stores.

[chainagent]

I took the 3M paint protection film Scotchgard PU8591e (transparent) and cut it in pieces and size I needed.

[joeydurango]

I'd let it wear through and then go build up a steel frame, and not worry any longer...  

Sorry, sorry.  Uncalled for, I know.

[SlowRide]

Sorry, sorry.  Uncalled for, I know.

So why'd you post it? sheesh. 

[joeydurango]

Because it was funny.  It's called having a little fun, that's all.  Don't get all bent out of shape...

And, in all seriousness, some materials are better suited than others for certain purposes.  A frame material that can catastrophically fail if dropped just the wrong way on a rock (especially when loaded with extra weight) is not ideal for backcountry exploits.  One that can literally be worn through with frame bag abrasion is even less ideal.  Food for thought.

[Area54]

I'd let it wear through and then go build up a steel frame, and not worry any longer...  

Sorry, sorry.  Uncalled for, I know.

Steel rusts man, go ti!

As suggested, cover the frame tubes with heavy protection tape. Even a couple layers of clear packing tape will work - and even lighter than 3M tape

[B_Bock]

Be careful on what type of clear tape you use. I lost quite a bit of clear coat when I removed the clear tape after the TDR. I used frame Protection tape that I purchased from Colorado Cyclist. Last couple of races I used 2 layers of blue painters tape. It worked well and was easy to remove.
I love the artistry and the beauty of a well made steel frame, but If you want to be light and fast carbon is a great choice. You will see more and more of these races won on carbon frames.

[joeydurango]

I tried to go ti, but Indy Fab couldn't make what I wanted in that material.  So I'm on the list for a Black Cat - stellar steel bikes!

"Light and fast", yada yada, is great and all, but "these races" are won on whatever's being ridden by the person with the most willpower and resistance to the sleep monster.  Frame material has nothing to do with it - unless, of course, you've broken your carbon frame on a rock and are stuck in the middle of nowhere.

[B_Bock]

I've completed the TDR, AZTR, Coconino 250, CSTR 400, yada yada,all on carbon with a light weight race build. I'm not hating on ti or steel. I'd ride on any of these materials and be happy that I'm out on the trail. Just sayin that carbon is a good option for a light weight rider.
 Maybe we should start a forum on frame failure while bike pack racing?

[joeydurango]

Awesome - it's obvious that it CAN last.  Nice work on all those races, I'd love to add some non-Colorado big stuff to my riding history, especially AZTR. 

I've spent the last 18 years working professionally in the bike industry, including on the World Cup MTB circuit, riding, racing, selling, and wrenching on bikes made out of carbon, steel, ti, aluminum.  I have seen more carbon frames break than all other materials combined several times over.  Not to get too serious, but all I'm saying is two things:

1) Certain materials are more fragile in certain types of incidents, and since we spend so much time trying to make everything bomber and dependable, I'm always curious why we tend to ignore some of the most obvious places to increase dependability for a very small weight penalty just because the bike industry wants to sell cheap plastic frames from Asia.  I am not saying that if you bikepack with a carbon frame, it will break - just that your chances are higher than with steel or ti, or even aluminum, and that the potential consequences are much higher than if you break a frame on a three-hour town ride where walking out is no big deal.

2) Frame material, beyond its lasting through an event, has nothing to do with how fast someone will complete a multi-day race.  In two-hour WC events, little things like frame material, gearing choices, and so on can matter.  In long races, such things fade into the background chatter, and what matters are things beyond even sheer fitness - determination, willpower, mental toughness.  That, for me, is one reason I enjoy bikepack racing as a pursuit and also just as a spectator - in a world full of product placement and advertising, this is one type of athletic pursuit that is still completely about the person involved.  Yes, gear matters, setup matters, familiarity and comfort matter - but it doesn't matter what you're on so long as you're good with it.  So although we may see more of these races won on carbon bikes just because of the proliferation of the same, let's not mistake that to mean that cost-cutting plastic bikes are "the best", or that they are better than anything else.

Unfortunately, I'm sure we will - and the major corporate commercialization of bikepacking is probably right around the corner... "Mike Hall won the TD on a carbon Pivot - that means I need a carbon Pivot, or I can't go fast!  Must buy stuff!" 

No one can figure out how to sell willpower, thankfully.  Now, I think it's time to walk to work... sorry for the book.

[Yogi the Barry]

I worried about frame wear with my carbon Ibis a couple years ago and applied tape to the frame where any pack/strap touched the frame. As mentioned in the thread, there are many tape options which work.
I'll add...

Straps - Make sure the straps are tight. Loose straps allow the bags to slide around more, which worsens the wear. Loose straps allow mud/dirt/sand to get between the strap and frame. New bags will loosen as the bag conforms to the frame. Once wet, tight straps will also loosen.

Carbon seatpost and bars - I normally run a Woodman carbon seatpost, but changed back to an aluminum post when using my Relevate seat bag. I worried about tire spray really mucking up the seat bag straps that wrap the seatpost. I also run carbon riser bars and was going to change those back to aluminum, but used untaped carbon bars without incident. I kept the bars clean, where the feed bags and Sweetroll fasten. About the only place I had any frame wear was a place where I didn't protect the frame - below the headtube badge, where the Sweetroll rubbed.

Re: Frame material
Without getting into the 'which material is more appropriate for bikepacking and/or endurance racing debate'...
During endurance events, I think I'm less likely to have frame breakage/damage because I ride more conservatively, compared to hammering when riding close to home.

What do people do to prevent severe abrasion to their carbon frames when racing with bike bags? Thanks for any thoughts.

[GerryL]

I have a carbon frame with a few thousand miles of pack toting use and I just use regular old electrical tape for protection. A piece for each of the downtube straps and longer strips on both sides of the top tube. Seems to be working so far.

[joeydurango]

+1 for electrical tape.  I've used it for paint protection and it's nice because it conforms to complex curves (like a lot of carbon tubes), and leaves relatively little residue when you remove it.  Also, Gorilla is now making a clear protection tape - I found some at my local hardware store.  Unfortunately it is wicked sticky and will do things like remove unprotected decals.  Not a good use/remove tape.

[Racingguy04]

anybody tried sewing some fleece like material to the velcro/bag to prevent abrasion? I'd like to have a method of protecting my frame that doesn't involve sticking tape to my frame. Anybody have any luck with that?

I love the way my carbon frame rides, I probably would have preferred a steel frame, but this carbon was cheaper than any comparably equipped steel frame.

[Yogi the Barry]

I envision the fleece picking up dust and then becoming a polishing pad... or coarser dirt/sand and becoming a grinding pad. Vinyl/electrical tape works great for bag/strap rubbing issues, is easy to remove and you can get it in clear or colors. Vinyl/electrical tape isn't the best choice for cable rub areas on the frame, but works great in this application. Only thing that makes steel a better choice over aluminum, or a carbon, frame is after the paint is worn thru. It's nice to prevent the paint from being worn thru...

anybody tried sewing some fleece like material to the velcro/bag to prevent abrasion? I'd like to have a method of protecting my frame that doesn't involve sticking tape to my frame. Anybody have any luck with that?

I love the way my carbon frame rides, I probably would have preferred a steel frame, but this carbon was cheaper than any comparably equipped steel frame.

[Racingguy04]

I envision the fleece picking up dust and then becoming a polishing pad... or coarser dirt/sand and becoming a grinding pad.

oo, that's a good point. guess I'll stick with tape. I'm kind of tempted by this http://m.bikemag.com/gear/review-sugru/ it'd be expensive for frequent applications, but might be worth it for longer races/rides.

[Couloirman]

Electrical tape is the way to go. The day I wear through my carbon frame with a frame bag, is the day I finally break down and pick up a lynskey titanium frame

[todd551k]

Joey, one of these days I'll own a Carbon Full Suspension bike and a nice steel hardtail that I'll come down to durango to buy from a little shop down there.  In the mean time thanks everyone for all the advice on protecting my carbon frame as I venture into the world of bikepacking/racing.