First Ever Arizona Trail Race

[AZTtripper]

I suspect this route is different than either of his previous thru rides. New route, new trails, new record.
Nice work Scott.

Yes this is closer to the blended trip I did in 06. Lots more ST then the route Scott raced in the fall of 05 but not the crazy bushwacking "warrior route" that Scott and Lee did in the spring.

I always wondered if it would be legal to carry a bicycle across Grand Canyon National Park ... even on one's back?

35-50 pounds of dead weight aside, the North and South Kaibab trails are pretty mellow hikes. Even if they do lose and gain ~5,500 feet of elevation, I'm doubtful that this is even close to the worst this sufferfest will surely dole out.

Have fun, ya'll!

The main route through the canyon is a major heard path so yes it really is all about the elevation loss and gain. 7 miles all down hill to the river 7 miles mostly flat from there to Cottonwood camp and then the grunt up 7 miles almost all up hill to the rim. This can easily be broken down into 3 days there is camping by the river or lodging at Phantom Ranch then a second camp at Cottonwood. That is how I did it in 06 and it was not the hardest part of the whole trip.

But I do remember a pic of Scott near the end of the hike after doing the whole thing in one day he definitely looked tired.

Ha. Ouch.

Should I pack snowshoes for the section at ~560 miles that tops out at 8k'?  What about the North Rim?  

Might not be a bad idea or you could just plan on traveling at night when the snow is firm.

When I was there in mid May of 04 there were only a few patches, Scott and Lee found walls of snow in 05. I keep hearing that we are going to have a big snow pack this year but not so much yet.

The route looks great hitting all of the good ST skipping a few sections that are known to be very overgrown and or not very ride-able even by AZT standards.

[sherpaxc]

This is very much on my bucket list.  So is the Tour Divide, CT, more road touring through Europe, touring through S. America, etc...Thank goodness I'm only 30!

[wookieone]

Damn You Scott!!! I had my 2010 all planned out, sort of, and then you got to throw this irresitable nuggte out there....I couldn't sleep last night...I am talking to my bosses today, if I can get the time off, I am in!!! I mean I loved the AZT 300, and to traverse the whole state, hike through the Grand Canyon(which I haven't even seen) man I may not sleep till april!

Excitedness aside, a couple Q's?  whats the proability of snow? Will the route fit in a GPS? Cues? My mind is racing for a good way to carry a loaded bike? Very intrigueing, very...peace Jefe

[Carney]

Holy hell - that's all I got. 

[ScottM]

If I try to conceptualize the Arizona Trail Race, from what little I know about the Arizona Trail, I feel like bike-portaging through the Grand Canyon would be a highlight. After a few hundred miles of intermittent but frequent hike-a-bikes skirting that frustrating edge of rideable, I know I for one would be grateful just to throw the useless thing on my back and walk free. But that's just me. :-)

Oh yes, it's a highlight!  There's nothing like arriving at the south rim by bike, through the quiet backwoods, throwing the bike on your back, hiking across, and then riding out the other side.



Another part of what makes the hike hard (IMO) is that your load may not be super heavy, by ultra-heavy backpacking standards, but it is almost certainly an awkward / unbalanced one.  I thought it might be a good 'break' for my tiring muscles, switching to different 'fresher' ones, but boy was I wrong...

I'm with Jill, can you sign up just for the bike carry section?

Want to carry my bike across?  Sherpa for hire?   

Yes this is closer to the blended trip I did in 06.

Yep, though yours was harder/longer still than this route.

Might not be a bad idea or you could just plan on traveling at night when the snow is firm.

I don't think the new ST near Flagstaff will be too much of an issue in late April unless it's a HUGE snow year.  If there are walls of snow on the north rim, however, we'll just take the road.  60+ miles of snow hiking is not what the race is about (good luck following the trail too).

[ScottM]

Damn You Scott!!! I had my 2010 all planned out, sort of, and then you got to throw this irresitable nuggte out there....I couldn't sleep last night...I am talking to my bosses today, if I can get the time off, I am in!!! I mean I loved the AZT 300, and to traverse the whole state, hike through the Grand Canyon(which I haven't even seen) man I may not sleep till april!

Hahaha, it is the sort of thing that can lead to restless nights for those so inclined.  I've had a few since 1/1/10 when I started seriously trying to convince myself I was 100% in.  More to come for sure.

Excitedness aside, a couple Q's?  whats the proability of snow? Will the route fit in a GPS? Cues? My mind is racing for a good way to carry a loaded bike? Very intrigueing, very...peace Jefe

Route will fit in a GPS no problem.  I will do some "broad stroke" cues, especially on the places where we are not on the AZT.  But GPS is really the only way to be sure to follow the route.

Snow is an unknown, but as I wrote just a minute ago, if there is this much snow:



We will just suck it up and take the highway.  That year it wouldn't have melted off until June.

I am not so concerned with the setting of 'records', since the AZT route will change in the next five years, with the completion of a couple more sections of trail.  So, if some years we get forced onto the north rim highway, so be it.  Better than trying (and dying) to ride the southern half of the trail when it is 100*+.

[krefs]

Well crap.  Like Jefe, I thought I had things pretty much planned out through June.   

[AZTtripper]

This is going to be a great one to watch I can see myself being glued to Trackleaders

Damn You Scott!!! I had my 2010 all planned out, sort of, and then you got to throw this irresitable nuggte out there....I couldn't sleep last night...I am talking to my bosses today, if I can get the time off, I am in!!! I mean I loved the AZT 300, and to traverse the whole state, hike through the Grand Canyon(which I haven't even seen) man I may not sleep till april!

Excitedness aside, a couple Q's?  whats the proability of snow? Will the route fit in a GPS? Cues? My mind is racing for a good way to carry a loaded bike? Very intrigueing, very...peace Jefe

Scott was able to get 811 miles in my Legend back in 06. I was able to follow most everything pretty easily the only thing I missed finding was a short piece of unmarked trail. If I had had a cue sheet I would likely have found it. So many feet from the highway go between two boulders the trail gets better a little ways in along the creek. The distance may have changed though as there was road construction in the area this summer.

Carrying the bike has been covered here http://www.bikepacking.net/forum/index.php/topic,90.0.html

I stick with my duffel bag theory and would also say it might be nice to know the schedule for the mule trains. I ran into two the first was easy at a wide spot the second time it was cliffy and I was lucky to have a ledge to put my gear on and jump out of the way.

I see Scott hasn't cut any slack at the start sticking to the 300 course is a brutal way to start things but then a big road stretch bypassing wilderness gets you up north fast. From Payson to the Mogollon rim is a bit rough but by the time you get to the Canyon there won't have been much hike a bike for a couple of hundred miles. 

[goldenboy]

what is the estimated time needed for this?

[ScottM]

what is the estimated time needed for this?

At what kind of pace?  How much sleeping?  I can't say for sure what the fastest times will be, but if you aren't going for broke, I'd say it's going to take minimum 8-10 days.  Possibly much more.  Finish times for just the 300 portion have been in the 3-5 day range, and as Tim noted, this route will stay with the 300 route all the way, just adding 400 or so miles beyond.

This way anyone doing the AZTR can count themselves a 300 finisher, and vie for placing in that event as well.  Much like the Iditarod, with its short course (350 mile) to McGrath vs the full race to Nome.

[Chad B]

I am not so concerned with the setting of 'records'

Each time I ride one of these ultra races, I seem to drift away from any notion of setting a record. I wish I had this mentaility earlier on in my ultra race career. That said, I think that completion seems a lot more important for this ride.

[ScottM]

Each time I ride one of these ultra races, I seem to drift away from any notion of setting a record. I wish I had this mentaility earlier on in my ultra race career. That said, I think that completion seems a lot more important for this ride.

Actually I just meant the notion of longstanding, comparable records, year to year.  I am still keen to see just how fast this sucker can go, and I am hoping others are of the same mindset.

[sherpaxc]

Each time I ride one of these ultra races, I seem to drift away from any notion of setting a record. I wish I had this mentaility earlier on in my ultra race career. That said, I think that completion seems a lot more important for this ride.

totally agree Chad.  While there are a few out there that are really able to push the envelope, I think completion is just as cool.  I've only tried one race and failed.  How humbling that was.  Once I let going of the mentality that I had to be fast with the big boys bikepacking become much more fun.  And a hell of a lot more freeing. 

[Chad B]

Actually I just meant the notion of longstanding, comparable records, year to year.  I am still keen to see just how fast this sucker can go, and I am hoping others are of the same mindset.

Oh, now that you said that, I am going to throw down.

It's on like flan!

[krefs]

Hey Scott, what exactly is at the Utah border where the AZT ends (i.e., how the hell do you get back to civilization?)?

[Chad B]

Hey Scott, what exactly is at the Utah border where the AZT ends (i.e., how the hell do you get back to civilization?)?

A sign and a dirt road, a few picnic tables, parking lot....basically nothing. The nearest store is miles away...Jacob Lake. Two options for riding from the border: ride back up the singletrack (the way you came) or dirt road then highway to Jacob's Lake. I have done part of the later during the Kaibab MC, it was not very much fun with the traffic.

Getting picked up/leaving a car there is the way to go.

[AZTtripper]

There is a campground at the state line House Rock Valley road runs north and south. There is some traffic around and there is a great hike in the area permit required to see "The Wave" http://images.google.com/images?q=the+wave+utah&oe=utf-8&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&client=firefox-a&um=1&ie=UTF-8&ei=RrZRS7mWF4OysgPd8KmGCA&sa=X&oi=image_result_group&ct=title&resnum=4&ved=0CBwQsAQwAw

You can get to the state line from north or south, south intersects with 89a to Jacob like Chad said but you can also turn east and get to the http://www.cliffdwellerslodge.com/ no big climb like getting back up to Jacob.

[ScottM]

Yeah, not much at the finish.  Hopefully someone is there to fetch your carcass from the trail.  It's a bit of a ride to anywhere 'civilized.'

[ScottM]

The AZT race site has been revamped, now including info for both the AZT 300 and the AZTR.

http://topofusion.com/azt/race.php

Also, I posted some thoughts on the AZTR on my diary:

http://www.topofusion.com/diary/2010/01/16/arizona-trail-race/

[Rob]

Do permits need to be attained before hiking the Grand Canyon?