TD'12 Race Discussion

[mtbcast]

Rob Roberts called in from near Helena. He’s been riding in the rain and hopes to push on to Butte today.

[mtbcast]

Rob Roberts called in from Butte last night. He’s eating tons of food and nursing his backside!

[mtbcast]

Joshua Weinfeld called in from Lincoln. He’s fighting knee issues but thinks the issue is behind him.

[ride MT]

Jay P making his thoughts be known....not too happy with the situation at the front this year it seems....
http://salsacycles.com/culture/tour_divide_the_view_from_the_sidelines

This article makes me pissed off and I am trying to figure out why...maybe because he is clearly calling into question the leaders' integrity, while at the end saying "I do not put anybodys efforts to the side."

[mtbcast]

Somewhat understandable. It seems like Jay accepts that as the race grows people inevitably will coagulate. I think he feels the ITT is close to the original intent or at the least has a better shot at preserving it. Riding together will always change the flavor of any individual's race whether overtly or subconsciously. This baby is walking now. Who knows what it will grow into? We have to grow with it and as organizers, spectators, and racers do our best to keep the rules in mind and understand that with increased participation there are some inevitabilities. I think to Jay and everyone who's gone stone-cold solo, you don't have to have an asterisk to know there's something special about someone who does it completely alone. Better? Worse? It's up to the individual.

[BobM]

Jay P making his thoughts be known....not too happy with the situation at the front this year it seems....
http://salsacycles.com/culture/tour_divide_the_view_from_the_sidelines

This article makes me pissed off and I am trying to figure out why...maybe because he is clearly calling into question the leaders' integrity, while at the end saying "I do not put anybodys efforts to the side."

I thought he spoke quite fairly and didn't call anyone's integrity into question - just made the obvious observation that 2 people riding side-by-side for so long are inevitably going to be more than just competitors, they will become friends.  If they don't like each other one of them would make a break.  In that sense it is certainly not an ITT for either person and so it becomes a totally different experience from what was intended for the race. That's not intrinsically good or bad - just different.  Do 2 people at riding at that level push each other harder or hold each other back?  Hard to say and perhaps it's a little of each as the race progresses.

[mtbcast]

Calls: Joshua Weinfeld called in from Basin. He’s having some pizza and heading for Butte tomorrow to get his seat post fixed. And Rob Roberts called in from Lima. He got some repairs in Butte at The Outdoorsman. Unfortunately he sliced a tire and is hoping his patches get him to the next bike shop.

[mtbcast]

Joshua Weinfeld called in Butte. He got his repairs at The Outdoorsman and is ready to head out!

[mtbcast]

Rob Roberts called in from Wise River Campground! He’s adjusting his sleep and hopes to get to Flagg Ranch!

[mtbcast]

Joshua Weinfeld called in Montana High Country Lodge. He recaps his ride from Butte, over Fleecer, and through the Beaverhead.

[mtbcast]

Joshua Weinfeld called in from Lima. He’s going to lay low for the day and rest his knees and achilles. And Rob Roberts called in from Cora. He’s battling a sore achilles too.

[JayP]

Jay P making his thoughts be known....not too happy with the situation at the front this year it seems....
http://salsacycles.com/culture/tour_divide_the_view_from_the_sidelines

This article makes me pissed off and I am trying to figure out why...maybe because he is clearly calling into question the leaders' integrity, while at the end saying "I do not put anybodys efforts to the side."

don't be pissed LTrain, this is all good fun! totally fine with the situation at the pointy end of the race this year, just pointing out things of change with progression. makes me curious what the future holds for TD, maybe becoming more of a ride then a race...which is fine but not how it started or it's intent.

making a point through typing words is sometimes tough (at least for me), i hope everybody takes everyone's opinions and thoughts with this in mind. hard to explain every little feeling and thought.

ride with a smile,
jayP

[mtbcast]

Joshua Weinfeld called in from Lima again. still nursing his achilles. He will probably be down for a bit trying to let this heal up a bit. He’s not out yet but will be assessing his situation.

[mtbcast]

Joshua Weinfeld called in from Lima to pull OUT! His achilles isn’t getting better and he doesn’t want to push it. Better to heal and ride!

[mtbcast]

Rob Roberts called in from Rawlins. He’s taking some time in Rawlins after a tough ride through the Basin. He’s going to throttle back a bit after passing out in a McDonalds!

[RideLikeAlf]

Jay P making his thoughts be known....not too happy with the situation at the front this year it seems....
http://salsacycles.com/culture/tour_divide_the_view_from_the_sidelines

This article makes me pissed off and I am trying to figure out why...maybe because he is clearly calling into question the leaders' integrity, while at the end saying "I do not put anybodys efforts to the side."

Gotta say I find myself on JayP's side of this particular 'divide'. I rode this year's race in what I supposed was the intended independent manner - even to the extent of riding past a couple of planned camp sites when I saw other riders already in situ. I simply couldn't conceive of making such a massive commitment to being in the race, in terms of training effort, time and money, and then riding, eating, sleeping in lock-step with someone else, and effectively comprising myself and my whole approach to the race. (I go down to my cycling club's Sunday morning run if I want a social ride with someone else.) I guess if you have my viewpoint, then inevitably it does take a little shine off what was nevertheless an incredible ride by the two guys at the front. It just would have been even more incredible (to me at least), if they had been riding in a more obviously independent fashion, as the vast majority of the first 30 or so finishers seem to have been doing. (BTW - I think the formation of "survival groups" further down the field is much more understandable.)

Personally, I will be hoping that a 'lone wolf' zips down the route in splendid isolation to win next year, but I won't be hugely surprised if a group of 3 or 4 rides in together in less than 16 days. I think a pattern may have been set, unfortunately.

     
     

[mtbcast]

Rob Roberts called in from Steamboat! He’s waiting to get some repairs.

[BobM]

...... It just would have been even more incredible (to me at least), if they had been riding in a more obviously independent fashion, as the vast majority of the first 30 or so finishers seem to have been doing. (BTW - I think the formation of "survival groups" further down the field is much more understandable.)

Personally, I will be hoping that a 'lone wolf' zips down the route in splendid isolation to win next year, but I won't be hugely surprised if a group of 3 or 4 rides in together in less than 16 days. I think a pattern may have been set, unfortunately.

It comes back to the question "Is this an ITT or a race?"  As the event gains popularity as a "race" more and more top riders will try it.  If you're at the front and there is another rider(s) of equivalent ability how will you separate from them?  They will not be willing to let you out of their sight and you are most likely not going to hang back and let them get ahead.  In fact, it's my understanding (I don't follow racing) that in most races there is a lead group, a chase group, and a peloton.  Then as the race progresses, people try to make jumps and breaks to move ahead.  Inevitably, if someone in the lead makes a break, he/she is chased and often run down by other leaders. In the TD the fast chasers often don't form a group (sometimes they do - Chris, Kurt, and Joe), but if there are multiple leaders I just don't see a top competitor letting another racer out of his/her sight at the front; once they are ahead you won't know what they're up to.  Matthew Lee solved this dilemma the last time he raced it by putting in a 195 mile first day and then maintaining that 50-60 mile lead most of the way through the race until he stretched it out in New Mexico.  If he had had a competitor capable of matching that effort there would have been 2 of them at Butts Cabin that first night.

[JayP]

starting to drive tomorrow...should be leaving Spray River trail head Monday ~4 a.m.

-JayP

[mtbcast]

WOOT!