TD`13 Race Discussion

[Donald]

I assume that JayP's record last year was set on a route free from snow and detours. Is his record the only one to be set under such conditions? If so, why would someone looking to set the record ever choose the GD? Has there ever been a GD totally unaffected by snow and fire detours?

This also raises the question as to whether the second Friday in June is the best time for the GD.

[Jilleo]

Is there a contradiction here? In the first part of this post you suggest that there is one annual race consisting of ITTs and GD combined. If that is correct, in 2012 JayP won the race and set the record.

I'm not sure what you mean. In the first part of my post I was talking about the Tour Divide and the Great Divide Race, which existed as two separate events in 2008 and in 2009, when the GDR effectively dissolved.

Beyond that, I don't understand the rest of your points. The only person in position now to possibly break the record is Jesse, and he'll have to face the same detours as Mike. If he finishes, Mike will win the race while JayP will hold onto the record, regardless of Mike's finishing time. If, later in the race, people are able to return to the closed roads, then I'm guessing they'll have a choice of whether or not to do so. If they want to challenge themselves on the GDMBR, they'll take the formerly closed route. But if they want to contest their position with the frontrunners in the 2013 Tour Divide *Race* (and I'm speculating here), I'm guessing they can take the same detours. Either way, this is mainly a self-regulated and self-recorded endeavor. But Mike Hall still wins the race. Just as Kurt Refsnider won the 2011 TD but didn't set a new record because of detours.

[Georg66]

The only person in position now to possibly break the record is Jesse, and he'll have to face the same detours as Mike. If he finishes, Mike will win the race while JayP will hold onto the record, regardless of Mike's finishing time. If, later in the race, people are able to return to the closed roads, then I'm guessing they'll have a choice of whether or not to do so.
...

If the now closed roads will be opened in some days, the later bike raceres will not (!) have a choice (provided, they want to finish the race according to the rules).

[Donald]

I'm not sure what you mean. In the first part of my post I was talking about the Tour Divide and the Great Divide Race, which existed as two separate events in 2008 and in 2009, when the GDR effectively dissolved.

Beyond that, I don't understand the rest of your points. The only person in position now to possibly break the record is Jesse, and he'll have to face the same detours as Mike. If he finishes, Mike will win the race while JayP will hold onto the record, regardless of Mike's finishing time. If, later in the race, people are able to return to the closed roads, then I'm guessing they'll have a choice of whether or not to do so. If they want to challenge themselves on the GDMBR, they'll take the formerly closed route. But if they want to contest their position with the frontrunners in the 2013 Tour Divide *Race* (and I'm speculating here), I'm guessing they can take the same detours. Either way, this is mainly a self-regulated and self-recorded endeavor. But Mike Hall still wins the race. Just as Kurt Refsnider won the 2011 TD but didn't set a new record because of detours.

In your previous post you said that the race was essentially a contrivance and was really a number of concurrent ITTs. That suggests that race times are to be compared to ITTs outside of the GD. Indeed, the following quote from the Rules concerning ITTs confirms this.

"Abide by TD Rules, carry a SPOT GPS tracker or other brand of GPS logger/tracker, and finish in no more than twice the standing course record (17days x 2) to be eligible for the same Divide racing General Classification that ranks group racers."

Accordingly, on Trackleaders' Tour Divide 2012 page, JayP is listed along with all the other participants in 2012 and is ranked 1st by time.

So, it could be argued that there is no race winner, only a General Classification winner.

2012 was unusual in that everyone followed the full race route as described in the Rules. This will not happen in 2013. That raises the question as to whether an effort over the full route trumps an effort made with course deviations as regards the General Classification for 2013.

I know this is a slightly frivolous point, so no pompous rebukes please, but the anarchist in me would love to see a way for "Yukon" Krauss to end up on top of the General Classification if he is the only person to follow the full route this year.

[Donald]

I see Mike Hall is camped just short of Pie Town. No doubt he will roll into town hoping to enjoy Pie Town's eponymous breakfast treat. I hope he realises that his daily mileage is just above the 200 mark. Achieving a 200 mile average would set an extraordinary benchmark, no matter what course he has had to follow. It would be a shame to drop below it for the sake of a piece of pie.

[annais]

It would want to be Damn Good Pie.

[Donald]

It would want to be Damn Good Pie.

It usually is, but it's not guaranteed. Last year I bought a pie to get me to Silver City. The only whole pie they had was apple and chilli. It was so unpalatable I barely ate a quarter of it.

[Donald]

It would want to be Damn Good Pie.

You caught me with my leaden boots on. I missed your reference.

[THE LONG RANGER]

It would be a shame to drop below it for the sake of a piece of pie.

Behold! The power of Pie Town!


And remind me to never race this Mike guy around the world, or anything. Man, those photos from the start of that race last year were amazing. He looked like he was from the future when compared to many of his fellow starters.

[Canbaroo]

So the early risers [read serious chasers!] are off on their way.

Jesse doing the detour after having a look down the prescribed route, like Mike, then turned back and headed West on the detour.

Jesse C 4.01am
Alex H 4.14
James O 4ish? ... not strong on the technology [SpoT] switch
Saemi 5.18
Reto 5.25
Hugh H 5.30 chasing hard to get back with his group after Walter B's mishap.

[Bradjdavies]

Hey guys - dug up this pic of Jesse in his BMX days (taken at X Games in his first ride back from having his ankle fused).

What a ride from the rookie in his first real ultra race!

[BobM]

Hey guys - dug up this pic of Jesse in his BMX days (taken at X Games in his first ride back from having his ankle fused).

What a ride from the rookie in his first real ultra race!

I think Kent Peterson did that trick in Wyoming in 2010 when he hit a fence across the road.

[BobM]

Along that same line of thought, we have a friend who lives in Cora, WY right along the route. He didn't know about the race until it was too late to help. However, I've given some thought to developing him into being a Trail Angel for riders in the future. I shall assume that is OK. But - here's the question for the TDR 2013 group - If he doesn't want to help everyone but instead wants to pick and choose, is that OK since he is right next to the road?

It's OK for him as he wouldn't be breaking any laws, but it would be horrible for the racers, since they would have to refuse his help or risk relegation.  Please do not put the riders in that position!

EDIT:  Since he lives on the route, he is certainly free to pick and choose which riders he comes out to the road and cheers for - most riders do appreciate that.

[Canbaroo]

 

Hey guys - dug up this pic of Jesse in his BMX days (taken at X Games in his first ride back from having his ankle fused).

What a ride from the rookie in his first real ultra race!

Pretty amazing talent ... given his current academic career [ref my earlier post] one must assume he didn't land on his head too often

[Newfydog]

Don't underestimate what a trail angel might do for a fellow cyclist. When I lived in Fernie i would frequently spot a rider and feed them and put them up for the night.  One time I found a guy with a trashed rear wheel, and we rebuilt it with a nice rhyno rim I had ( I bought a pair just to get the heavy rear wheel so the front was not used).
Heck, when we lived in Singapore we put up a round the world rider for a week and rebuilt the whole bike.

If someone did that for a racer, people would consider it unfair advantage, but in a real life trip, help is out there.

How to restrict it to it random kindness in the smartphone age is tough though......if I saw a post here of someone needing help on a tour I might drive out to help, but obviously we can't do that in the race, or pretty soon there will be a shimano jeep out there fixing bikes.

[SlowDave]

Last year I bought a pie to get me to Silver City. The only whole pie they had was apple and chilli. It was so unpalatable I barely ate a quarter of it.

Blasmaphy.  The apple and green chili pie is what is a gift from the gods.

[davidhaile]

It's OK for him as he wouldn't be breaking any laws, but it would be horrible for the racers, since they would have to refuse his help or risk relegation.  Please do not put the riders in that position!

EDIT:  Since he lives on the route, he is certainly free to pick and choose which riders he comes out to the road and cheers for - most riders do appreciate that.

I've investigated a little more. I think his land borders the route but his house is too far back to be useful. I will suggest that next year he puts up a sign and possibly maintain a water source to tell TDR riders that they are welcome to camp on his land. He said he was herding cows down the road and they split around a TDR rider in a tent who was very worried that his bike was going to get trampled.

[the tortoise]

Billy Rice has already completed the course this year without detours.

[BobM]

Billy Rice has already completed the course this year without detours.

Good point!  And by the time he reaches NM the route may be open there.

[flyboy]

It would want to be Damn Good Pie.

Riding 200 miles a day for two weeks? I would want some pie!  

On another note, by this stage of the race there is normally about 120 pages of comment. Why is it so quiet here this year? Is it because there are 130-odd riders on the route that might normally be in here?