Tour Divide 2015 - race discussion thread

[the tortoise]

Word in the peleton is that Salsa has reps out near Antelope Wells and that they are planning an alien abduction of Neil before the finish line! New Mexico is famous for that so no one will be any the wiser!

[kiwidave]

Salsa - personally I would prefer if they had a 650B El Mariachi!! Salsa Cutthroat ... I wonder how much the carbon Pivot's sales got a boost from Mike Hall's amazing 2013 ride?

[Bluechip]

Did I hear that Jay had some bottom bracket issues with the new press fit bb?  I am a Fargo ti owner who might be interested in the Cutthroat.

[Snarkley]

His BB blew up. Per Kid, Jay took the cranks off his prototype to build the current bike. Would an alien abduction be considered public services according to the rules?

[joeRinehart]

Did I hear that Jay had some bottom bracket issues with the new press fit bb?  I am a Fargo ti owner who might be interested in the Cutthroat.

Kid Riemer @ http://salsacycles.com/culture/introducing_cutthroat:

"We have had great personal success with PressFit 41. Regarding JayP stopping to replace his, we made one critical mistake in that we did not send him a new BB when we sent him the proper painted frame. He moved his BB from his proto frame and that was a massive mistake on our part. PressFit BB’s are one and done in that once installed, they should not be removed and reinstalled. We have confidence in PressFit 41."

[blurltd]

As much as I think the Cuttthroat is a cool bike I would never buy a bike with a PF30 BB. Looks lie both JP and Lael had issue with them on this race. Not to say nobody had issues with threaded BBs but with PF BBs track record overall? You get it. Now back to the race How about Lael's amazing performance? Sick at the beginning now back near the front! Amazing!!

[THE LONG RANGER]

Please note this not intended to take anything away from Neil B. and his unbelievable efforts...keeping Jay within his sights this far into it. Much respect for Neil and his ability - he's certainly making this an exciting race.
However, considering the absolute brilliant marketing move by Salsa to unveil a new TD-bred whip on the eve of this year's event, along with JayP piloting it, I'm convinced Jay will prevail if he stays healthy and the Cutthroat continues to perform without any growing pains. Can't say I would've done it any differently (introduction of the Cutthroat).  

Mind-blowing performance by everyone in this race so far.  

Me? I'm kinda bummed Salsa is being so aggressive with this type of  marketing - and not just w/TD. Obv. it's not my call to make. Maybe Matt Lee has a succinct, thoughtful, and philosophical take on it all, as is his trademark (sic!). Mad respect to JayP and all the racers, but Salsa's idea of TD Dream Machine is very different from mine. Lots of interesting ideas, but lots of head scratching ones too - I anticipate this whole bike is still in beta and won't really be ready until v2. Salsa kinda goes fast and quick on their revisions - which in one sense seems exciting and cool, and another seems that maybe some things just weren't ready...

I think experimenting with bike designs is a great thing to do though, and JayP getting this massive support (in exchange for an incredible amount of confidence on an as-yet truly tested rig) gives me hope a bone will be thrown over yonder one day

Still, it seems it's a sea change type of thing for the TD. Is Salsa going to become an Official Sponsor of the Tour Divide? (ala Dirty Kanza). Change is the one true invariable

BB story sounds pretty plausible though - are there any truly GOOD BB these days, that don't break after a coupla days on the TD? I had to change mine 2 or 3 times one year.

[Majcolo]

Me? I'm kinda bummed Salsa is being so aggressive with this type of  marketing - and not just w/TD. Obv. it's not my call to make. Maybe Matt Lee has a succinct, thoughtful, and philosophical take on it all, as is his trademark (sic!). Mad respect to JayP and all the racers, but Salsa's idea of TD Dream Machine is very different from mine. Lots of interesting ideas, but lots of head scratching ones too - I anticipate this whole bike is still in beta and won't really be ready until v2. Salsa kinda goes fast and quick on their revisions - which in one sense seems exciting and cool, and another seems that maybe some things just weren't ready...

From a business perspective their methodology keeps bike costs down - it's classic lean design. You can risk a ton of capital and spend years developing and testing with a small group and then pray that you got it right when you release the model, or you can release a viable product with a far shorter initial design cycle into the market at a more affordable price point and incorporate the feedback from a huge number of people into the next iteration. Maybe your TD Dream Machine idea is way better, and they incorporate those design elements the next time around.

As an example, they did this very successfully with the Warbird which is a great bike for the money and has been good in every iteration so far.

[kiwidave]

It looks like the second group (7-12) has dropped one rider with Martin Vit now 60 miles off the back. Lael is looking strong in 10th and riding 90 miles ahead of the ghost of Eszter. Up front Josh Kato is edging slowly closer to the leading duo - wow!!

Just as they head into NM, which many say is the toughest section, the race for the win is getting even more intense. Will they get under 15 days?  

[blurltd]

BB story sounds pretty plausible though - are there any truly GOOD BB these days, that don't break after a coupla days on the TD? I had to change mine 2 or 3 times one year.
[/quote]

I'm not saying threaded BBs are superior, but they work, pretty darn good and better track records than Press Fits. I can change them out on my own, and if a I hear things creaking I can at least unthread, slap on some grease and see it it helps. With PF BBs, it's not a one and done. Also with PF40, PF30, PF92000 gazillion, you could show up to a bike shop and they won't have it, most shops will have threaded BBs.

Lael is top 10 now! Amazing.

[jmh]

Hard to believe that less than a half of a mile separates JP and Neil now.  Crazy after 2150 miles of racing. 

[nowayjose]

Just kidding, but do bike shops in TD check for hidden motors on BB? I can not believe the speed the top contenders are moving. Lael putting so many miles on Ezter's record. Ezter finished 7th on 2012! Wow.

[BobM]

Just kidding, but do bike shops in TD check for hidden motors on BB? I can not believe the speed the top contenders are moving. Lael putting so many miles on Ezter's record. Ezter finished 7th on 2012! Wow.

2012 had snow over all of Elk Pass, 5 miles of snow on Flathead Pass, several miles on Galton Pass, and I can't remember what the racers had on Whitefish, Red Meadow, Richmond, etc.  Conditions this year are MUCH more favorable at least for the early part of the route.

[the tortoise]

2012 had snow over all of Elk Pass, 5 miles of snow on Flathead Pass, several miles on Galton Pass, and I can't remember what the racers had on Whitefish, Red Meadow, Richmond, etc.  Conditions this year are MUCH more favorable at least for the early part of the route.

That is true BUT Lael has had her own issues this year and a record run is going to require favorable conditions. But the real bummer is that the course always seems to be changing so how can you compare??
Perhaps with varying weather conditions and course changes, the focus should be on the placing and not the overall time.

[welnic]

If it says 1/2 mile then that is just a Spot discrepancy. They're riding together. Judging from Jay P past performances, such as this year's Iditabike, there won't be a sprint finish. If someone can get away in the last day or so then they will, but if they are together coming into Antelope Wells I don't think they'll sprint. I think that riding across the line together at the end of one of these races without a sprint is pretty classy.

The Cutthroat does have legitimate reasons to use a press-fit BB. You have more design flexibility around the bottom bracket if you use a press-fit, especially with a carbon bike. I don't think they did it just because it's trendy.

The main thing that I think they compromised on the Cutthroat is putting a suspension corrected fork on there. If they had fully committed to having a rigid fork they could have a longer head tube and a noticeably bigger front triangle for a frame bag.

[Eszter]

That is true BUT Lael has had her own issues this year and a record run is going to require favorable conditions. But the real bummer is that the course always seems to be changing so how can you compare??
Perhaps with varying weather conditions and course changes, the focus should be on the placing and not the overall time.

Or we just appreciate each ride for what it was/is each year.

No doubt about it, Lael is crushing my record time, even with the ~6-7 hour advantage that the Wamsutter detour gives accounted for. She's trimming the fat off the time in all the right places...towns. And riding fast too. If she holds it together, she's going to make a great pink dot ghost to chase for future women. 

[Krampus Snail]

Why does the Wamsutter route give an advantage (assuming no highway construction)?

[mtbcast]

#‎TourDivide15‬ - John Bowers called in from the Wyoming border to report his missing iPhone which Team Rice Burner has found!

http://mtbcast.com/site2/category/td15/

[Killy]

Hey riders, John Bowers' phone has been picked up by Billy Rice who is staying at Flagg Ranch tonight (campground? ) if u see Peter Yerger, John Bowers, or Greg Goodman, tell them to call Nancy or Ariel for number to contact Billy. Thanks, Billy!

[Mike McElveen]

I'm really pulling for Lael, but it's bittersweet.  No one has more class and great results than EZ.  And she's right:  appreciate each of their rides since they really are different courses.  Long live EZ; Go Lael!

BTW, for those of you who follow professional Cross Country racing I wonder if you've noticed how much Lael and Howard Grotts look alike.  And climb alike.  Check Lael's climbing segment times versus the front-running men.