Tour Divide 2017 - race discussion thread

[Ghoulwe]

I think it'd be sad to the race go down the "official" road; fees, insurance, sponsors... However, it does seem that sooner or later the increased numbers of riders will force some changes. For now, I wouldn't worry too much. Matt makes some good points about FB, perhaps after things die down in a couple of weeks he'll re-evaluate the idea to nix FB for next year.  Maybe it ain't broke and doesn't need fixing. For me this forum is fine for following the TD.

They'll always be white dots. To me, they represent people struggling towards a goal, out of the race, out of the limelight.

[Jilleo]

Alexandera Houchin set out from Banff on an ITT yesterday, it looks like she's making pretty good time - might be one to watch.

Thanks for the heads up. She's making good progress after the reroute. I'm excited there's another woman to watch.

[megand]

I liked her video she made of her ride in '15   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EpFSFo_vVPQ

Thanks for the link Mike! That was a fun little video - and led me to discover her blog, where she posted just two days ago, about the trip ahead. Jill, I think you'll enjoy this, it was a captivating read. I'm definitely cheering her on now!  https://alexandherkrampus.wordpress.com/2017/07/02/banff-alberta-canada-2/

[cloudrider]

Sadly Forums generally have become old school and this one is in decline as a focal point for TD race and pre-race information.

The emergence of communication mediums Instagram/Twitter/What’s App have fragmented the audience. Many simply now follow their friends and favourites. Facebook event pages are a dog’s breakfast. Some of the stuff getting posted up by ‘spot’ chasers was mind boggling …. on the TransAm, ‘I found him asleep behind some bushes’ and the self appointed ‘trail angels’ are another emerging problem.

I could happily live without Facebook however it is an essential information outlet for business and race marketing for me [Monaro Cloudride]. I also run an email list for the occasional spam as there are many riders who don’t have a Facebook account. Unfortunately there is no one info dissemination source that fits all. Like it or not [Facebook] we’re stuck with it.

I don’t have a volume problem with riders at the moment however I am conscious of keeping it simple into the future. I will roll with the punches when the time comes.

Just to add to Dave’s stats.
2015 TD race thread  was 94 pages with 478,000 hits
2017 TD race thread is at 36 pages with 61,000 hits … that’s a hit between the eyes.

2018 Tour Aotearoa [3,000k] start list is currently at 648.

2017 Indian Pacific Wheel Race race tracker had 1,360,500 views

I too add my appreciation for Mathew, Scott and Joe for their consuming passion, interest and tireless work in pulling the threads together each year. Looking ahead and the glass half full, maybe TD has arrived at a critical mass that is injecting a substantial tourist dollar into the many communities along the way of the race and there is a substantial ‘insurance investment’ of good will and $$$$$ that will stand the race in good stead if the storm clouds gather.

Cheers Steve

[Bagger]

"Which route do you suggest TD go?"

I think it is pretty much impossible to control riding the great divide because it's open. It isn't owned. It isn't groomed by an org. It just exists. It's a well known, well documented route (it's changed over time) that has been ridden for decades. Thus as I said, the barrier to entry is nil. Bike, some gear, a will to move forward. That right there makes the concept down right impossible to control. Other events change their route every year. That's the barrier to entry in those events. A person has to register / pay / whatever, to get the GPX or cue cards the night before. Controlling group size can't happen with this rodeo. A person can try, but what exactly is the recourse? Not being noted in the annals of a non-official event? That's about it really. They can carry a SPOT and roll on, posting for their friends to watch along the way.

I don't see social media, specifically FB, as inorganic growth. And none of the groups specified are anywhere near "viral". In fact the one left standing at the moment is pretty tame, informative and doesn't have a viral-level following at all. I also disagree that content is produced **after** the event. Content is produced before the event in mags (online and print), on rider's public social media and on some very well known sponsor pages. It's on Wikipedia. It's happening, and has been happening in a cycle for maybe three years. Before, during, after, repeat. The barrier to entry in user generated content has never been lower. There are riders this year that have more Instagram followers than all of the current and former FB groups combined. They are tossing info out there more than on any of the FB groups. Just making a point that content creation is happen all over the place at all times.

"Personal odyssey" is a great phrase as a sum of what many riders discuss on the MTB Podcast call-ins. With there only being a handful of gents that can ride this <20 days, the majority are truly on a personal odyssey. No chance to really win. No chance to break the official, non-official records. Just out there eating dirt, dodging horses and making my dots move so I can live through their personal odyssey this "race" year. Annals, unofficial records; these are not things a Jedi cares about in such instances.

No one owns or controls the trail, the future or the underground status of anything. Squashing FB groups to keep things underground is silly. It's no longer underground if there are TED talks, documentaries and mags writing about it. I'm not staying "it's over!!". I am saying that change is happening and resistance is futile. Rather than resisting, you should be proud. I'd bet that if you stepped away, the community would step up. It's grown legs of it's own and you are a part of that. And if it doesn't... I guess after a few years of no unofficial event you will be back to a smaller format which seems to be your goal is with the FB kibosh.

My suggestion, as HST once wrote: "Buy the ticket. Take the ride."

[davew]

My suggestion, as HST once wrote: "Buy the ticket. Take the ride."

What if the price of the ticket was completing another (any) bikepacking race?

[tanadog]

What if the price of the ticket was completing another (any) bikepacking race?

Yip, seems to me that trackleaders is the right medium to control "entries" and a completion of a multi-day event an appropriate standard.

On the FB front, I think the unofficial TD pages filled a vacuum. If the TD had up to date web presence and/or central point for info/updates I think there'd be alot less discourse

[bakerjw]

Hats off to MTBCast and Trackleaders for what they do. The downside is that higher visibility makes it more difficult to force the event back into the underground.

One thing to keep in mind is that people live vicariously through others. Last year, I rode the TD starting a week after the Grand Depart. My workplace productivity took a major hit that day as people were watching me via my Delorme tracking page. When a new blip would pop up, it was a big deal. I can't chide people for putting up a FB post when they get data access to let everyone who cares know how they are doing. My visually impaired wife would be utterly lost if something were to happen to me and the occasional update through my Delorme that things are fine is very reassuring to her.

Where to go from here? Get more people to focus on doing ITTs. People are going to want to be involved in the GD as it is a happening event. If visibility is the problem, focus on the personal ITT challenge which kind of forces it back towards its roots.

This year I started an ITT. I was in the best shape that I've been in for the last 30 years. My bike and gear were solid and I felt that I had a very solid game plan. For whatever reason though, I had a knee decide to become problematic on day 1. Day 1? Riding heavily, running regularly, weight training with no problems and on Day 1 my knee throws a fit? At 53, I wasn't going to keep pushing forward with a risk of causing a long term injury so I faced the fact that I just can't push my body like I used to when I was younger. Sadly, I feel that people that have experiences like mine have helped exacerbate the underlying reason for this latest "dust up" for lack of a better word. This year I was anything but underprepared, it was just a case of the body not being willing.

If you force the TD to be what you think that it should be, then you risk pissing people off. Like it or not, that is just human nature.

[Bagger]

"Buy the ticket. Take the ride." was meant for the race director. Which is to say, embrace what is happening because there is no controlling it.

The pre-req idea... it doesn't solve the major issues posed:
1. Open course, free to anyone anytime. No one owns this so there is no governance.
2. Most who ride don't care about the record books. It's the personal quest so... you know...
3. Making a real race just bumps up the high profile even higher so it will never be underground.
4. Cat's out of the bag any way you slice it.

I'd say "create a new route every year" to control the N, but does it matter? The semi-classic route is known. Probably a better question for others.

[mikepro]

..., I'd love to stage a special throwback year of TD in which smart phones and GPS navigators were prohibited. Make people go back to navigating by cues for a year. I think it could make for some really nice / challenging personal growth. It's not easy to navigate by cues, but boy does it teach you to know a route well.

I, for one, would love that as well.

[Jilleo]

I, for one, would love that as well.

There's still the Freedom Challenge, 2,400 km race across South Africa where GPS and smart phones are prohibited (flip phones are okay for calling the race director when you're hopelessly lost.) The Freedom Trail isn't a nice signed route like the Divide — there is a surprising lot of off-trail travel, cattle tracks, ancient foot trails, long-forgotten wagon routes, and it's South Africa so even the major roads are unsigned (not that you venture anywhere near a major road.) I sure improved my map and compass navigation skills during my ride in 2014, but I'm not sure I'd characterize the experience as personal growth ... more like permanently scarred. ;-)

[Flinch]

~ And now for something completely different ~

Alexandera Houchin (ITT) looks like she made it to Eureka, hit the hardware store, rode a mile out of town, came back to the hardware store, and is now at the muni park in town. She was on fire the first two days. Bike issues? Anyone have intel?

Glen

[MikeI]

~ And now for something completely different ~

Alexandera Houchin (ITT) looks like she made it to Eureka, hit the hardware store, rode a mile out of town, came back to the hardware store, and is now at the muni park in town. She was on fire the first two days. Bike issues? Anyone have intel?

Glen

Hope things are well. She cruised through Canada !  Is there even a bike repair anything in Eureka

[Flinch]

No bike shops in Eureka. Looks like she headed out of town the second time, returned, and is now on north end of town, east of Post Office a few blocks. Not sure if it is a motel/lodge/?

Sure hope she is OK. She appeared to be quite capable first 2 days ~ 140 mile/day.

[mtbcast]

#TourDivide17 Rick Ashton called in from Grants!

http://mtbcast.com/site2/category/td17/

[Jeff Tomassetti]

Rick Ashton is on track to be the oldest clean TD race finisher ever at 70.5 years old. Please correct me if I am wrong. He just avoided being ghosted as a tourist but he is picking up the pace now and riding at night. He sounds clear and happy. Go Rick!!

[MikeI]

There's nine riders on the pavement right now, between downtown Silver City and the Separ Rd turnoff ... rolling for the Border.

[mtbcast]

#TourDivide17  Lynne Slivovsky called in overnight from near Separ as she neared her finish! And she finished this morning!

http://mtbcast.com/site2/category/td17/

[mtbcast]

#TourDivide17 Lynne Slivovsky called in with her finish call!
http://mtbcast.com/site2/category/td17/

[bikelite]

Hope not Moab Cyclery.

I have to add that during the race I also had some bad customer service at mcds,wal mart and the dollar stores. Starting in Colorado. Always young employees but it was everyone at silver city wal mart. I work in tourism - Moab bike shop- u have to be kidding in how people who work in these businesses in the southwest act like punks to grown adults who have jobs families lives etc. I would be fired for treating people the way I was treated the last 10 days. I demand a lot more respect than I was given.