Down jacket and pants

[J-No]

I'm looking for something to throw on when I stop, and also as a bailout if I get really cold.  I'm wearing a Patagonia R4 as my outer layer when riding and I really like it.  As it gets relegated to bike use, I'd like to wear the down jacket every day as well.  I'd like something warm and with a hood.  Regular use for sub zero temps here in MN

I was looking at the Mountain Hardwear sub zero with a hood (seems to be the warmest), the Patagonia sweater thing with a hood, and some Montbell stuff.

For pants I was looking at Patagonia micro puffs pants and the Mountain hardwear compressor pants.

Any thoughts?

-We are in the process of getting 7-10 inches in the next 24 hours, should be excellent riding weather!!

[Pivvay]

I've got a Patagonia DAS (my climbing belay parka), a 9 oz synthetic hooded pullover and a 12 oz super puffy down hooded Nunatak jacket.

The Nunatak is the nicest piece by far but it's also the most expensive. So far I'm leaning towards taking the DAS to AK because it's big enough to go over everything, doesn't mind getting a little wet, it's tough enough to survive a little spill (if it's crazy cold riding) and it's super warm. My Nunatak is half the weight though!

For pants I have essentially a lighter weight full side zip version of the Patagonia pants. I have a 7oz version with no size zips but that's impractical in the field for winter where you want to put it on over everything else.

[jkcustom]

For the Minnesota races only...I have to wonder about the bulk/weight factor. Having skied it last year (and out twice as long as the bikers) I think I had my down coat on a couple of times...when making camp (I had to sleep out twice) and making water once. I was warm enough from skiing that I don't think I put on my fleece pants (all that I had). The point being...I am really trying this year to limit the amount of worst case scenario gear I am lugging around. Yes...I will plan for the worst...but having too much stuff will make things bad for you, too. It is one of the ultimate compromise dilemmas in endurance travel.
That being said...I would love to have a pair of light, full zip insulted pants!

[bmike-vt]

wonder if a wallcreeper would work. certainly not for riding... but it would double as sleep system and let you set up camp, boil water, etc.

[Kid Riemer]

DAS Parka from Patagonia. It will last you forever. I have their puffy insulated sidezip pants and they have been very nice to have as well.

[Lonesome Luddite]

I recently picked up the Montbell UL Inner Parka & Pants.

I have always carried a bailout jacket & pants at the AHU, but the old ones I had were way too heavy.  Several times on the bike I've had to use them (-35f anybody), but when I put them on to ski last year I almost passed out from the heat. 

The Montbell stuff probably isn't as warm as the old stuff I carried, but it is so much lighter and smaller it's ridiculous. 

[J-No]

That Mont Bell UL inner parka looks great.  It's $100 less than the Mountain Hardwear too.

[Eric]

Look at the Integral designs Denali pants, they are fantastic. The Mont Bell ones are lighter (and suuuper compressible) but not as warm. Mt. Hardware's Chugash / Compressor pants have in the past been overbuilt and on the beefy side. Patagonia's are a good middle ground and solid.

For big down Jackets - Consider the Feather Friends Volant hooded, or even the more substantial Frontpoint.
I have the Frontpoint and it's my go-to really cold Jacket, but it's huge to sleep in and a bit overkill for the short time "camping" when snow biking.

Plan B is having a thin synthetic puff layer (hooded) that you can still ride in when you are getting going or for big downhills when you will drop into a cold sink and freeze... and then a mont bell down jacket to layer over it for stopping / camping.
That's a more versatile system.

[J-No]

Thanks.  I'm kind of ruling out the Mountain Hardwear, both jacket and pants.  I'm thinking Mont Bell jacket and the patigonia pants, but I'll check out the integral design pants.

I rode 2 hours last night (10pm -midnight) on a ungroomed snowmobile trail.  Avg speed 5 mph.  The windchill was -22deg F.  Everything worked well, although 2 hours is a far cry from 30-40 hours. A base layer top, wool cycling jersey, and my patigonia R4 was perfect.  Moose mitts are incredible--thin smartwool liners and that's it.  All I wore on the bottom was shorts and craft storm tights, I think I'll get a light baselayer to wear underneath.  My legs were cold to the touch, but felt fine.

I want a different face mask to see if it will be a bit more comfortable, but I could live with what I wore.

[JayP]

I have used the MH Sub Zero Hoody Jacket, it's nice but it is a little short and not sized big enough to go over everything.

My Montbell Parka fits much nicer. In comparrison warmth was the same but the Montbell is lighter and more compressable therefor being a better choice for racing. Also like the shell it uses.

The new Montbell Tech pants are a great choice for below the waist too!

[Eric]

yeah for mont bell, I recently got the Alpine light parka and it totally rocks.

[J-No]

Eric,

I have an email out to mont bell, but what its the difference between the Alpine light parka and the inner parka?

I tried the Mt Hardwear on last week and it felt a little short in the front. 

[JayP]

J-no, I am thinking you might want the Permafrost Down Jacket. It is the warmest they offer with a nice cut.

I also carry a UL Thermawrap. The Permafrost is for the times when not moving. The Thermawrap is the warmer layer you can ride with without being to hot. THink of the Thermawrap as your next upgrade from your standard clothes you are wearing,the next shirt per say, and just as light but warmer. It is synthetic too so OK to sweat in.

Put these pieces together and you are golden for the coldest of temps.

Make sense...

[Eric]

What Jay said...
The Alpine light is a step down in warmth from the Permafrost. But that said It's a great jacket and quite cozy with a roomy cut.

[Slim]

I have biked in my Mtn Hardw. Chugash pants (older synthetic pants) a few times. It is great when the weather is very  cold and you are cold. If you are pedaling hard they are almost always to warm. They are heavy though, so for bikepacking use I would look a the MontBell, or Backpackinglight pants.
Get down if it's only for very cold camp use but synthetic if you would ever consider riding in them or using them in temps closer to freezing, it's hard to keep pants dry, since you end up sitting and kneeling on them.

For jackets it depends how warm you want it. I have a DAS parka  (synthetic from Pata) but it's not very warm, only about 1" of single layer loft. It has a nice long cut though and a big hood. My choice if you might have to ride or hike in it for an extended time.

If you would only wear it while active for brief moments you might want down: much lighter, smaller and more durable, and many more options to choose from. Mont Bell is very light and very cheap, I think you said you were in MN? Midwest Mountaineering has them and they are having a sale right now. Look closely at fit and function as down jackets vary a lot. Patagonia has the Fitzroy in the warmer hooded versions, Mtn HW makes both jacket and parka versions of their sub-zeros as well as SL versions that have a the Conduit SL membrain(similar to windstopper/dryloft), Feathered Friends have great stuff but you can't try it on, so communicate clearly with them. RAB is another company that does better at the extreme side of things, less streetwear like.

[Slim]

DAS Parka from Patagonia. It will last you forever. I have their puffy insulated sidezip pants and they have been very nice to have as well.

Unfortunately synthetic parka's like the DAS will not last for ever. I just got one last year because I had to replace my Golite 6 Month Night parka after it lost it's loft. All insulation will loose it's loft over time, but with synthetics it's a fairly rapid process (4 yrs for mine, this will depend on use and abuse), down will last several times longer especially if you regularly stuff it tight.
Also I am not aware of any really warm synthetic parka's out there anymore now that the 6 Month is discontinued, that one was about twice as thick as the DAS parka.

[Slim]

EDIT:  Backpackinglight doesn't list the cocooc pants anymore, must've been an website error.

[Pivvay]

the cocoon pros are nice. Mine are super light and the full zip rules for winter.

[J-No]

Thanks for the notes everyone.  I went with the Mont Bell Alpine Light down parka and also some Mont Bell Down pants.  It seems really warm, especially for it's weight.  The cut is roomy, it fits over all of my layers.

[Pivvay]

i think you'll like those. My wife loves her MB Alpine light